Since the beginning of the controversy regarding Gov. Sarah Palin's pregnancy, one aspect that has been commented on continually is that her appearance last spring did not mesh with expectations of a "normal" pregnancy.
At the time of the announcement, March 5th, 2008, the news that she was expecting was regarded with utter astonishment. Although Palin claimed at the time that she had to announce the pregnancy when she did because "people were beginning to notice," and that her clothes were getting "snugger and snugger," in fact the only person who has ever stated this IS Gov. Palin. (Even the article in which Palin is quoted as saying her clothes were getting tighter has as its main theme the fact that no one - not even her staffers - suspected she was pregnant.)
And a quick digression: I have always wondered, after reading this explanation for the public acknowledgment of a pregnancy that was allegedly already in its seventh month, if no one had EVER "noticed" her clothes getting tight, at what point would Palin have announced it? It's a fair question. Or would she have just showed up with a baby one day? She seems to be implying exactly that.)
Not one person has ever come forward and stated that they even suspected Gov. Palin to be pregnant prior to March 5th, at which point she would have been – based on her own announced due date – approximately 29 weeks pregnant with her fifth child. Not one staffer, not one journalist, no one. One sole journalist, Cherie Shirrey of KTVA, within 48 hours of the controversy erupting in August, jumped to Palin's defense and claimed that she had seen Palin numerous times for interviews and "in the studio" prior to Trig's birth (implying that it was between the time of the announcement – March 5th – and the birth six weeks later) and that Palin was definitely pregnant. Here's the blog post I did about this last December. However, Palin's daily schedule (obtained under a FOIA request) for the two months prior to Trig's birth in fact shows not a single visit to this TV station's studio. I have personally written Ms. Shirrey asking her to corroborate her statement. I have inquired about the dates of these interviews, topics covered, and why no video or stills are available of any of these interviews. I have received no answer.
After the announcement of her nomination on August 29th, one photo had appeared of Gov. Palin pregnant with a previous child (prior to the alleged pregnancy with Trig in 2008.)
This photo was provided by her parents to the news media as part of a large group of family photos that were released very shortly (within a day or two) after her VP pick. Although in a couple of places it has been suggested that this is not actually Palin at all (based on the fact that frankly the woman in the photo does not seem to look much like Sarah Palin does now) neither the Palin family nor the McCain campaign retracted the photo or ever stated it was not she. This photo has been shown widely, specifically to cast doubt on whether she is Trig's mother, and has been effective in doing so. I believe that if they had been able to retract the photo by claiming that it was someone else and had been released by mistake, that they would have done so.
Her hairstyle and general appearance actually are consistent with other photos we have of her from the late eighties into the early nineties. This comparison below shows Palin, I believe, looking very much similar to the photo of her late in pregnancy.
(And, no, I have no clue at all why she is wearing a crown, so don't bother to ask.)
Although rumored to be of her late in her pregnancy with Track (in 1989), as far as I can determine that's never been confirmed. However, based on hairstyle, my guess is that the photo is either from Track's pregnancy or Bristol's pregnancy two years later (1991.) Willow was born in mid-summer, 1995, and based on the surroundings, I do not believe this to be a mid summer scene.
Regardless of the exact year, however, one thing is clear. Gov. Palin is not only pregnant, she is in this photo I would say larger than average, particularly so if this might be her first pregnancy. In precise medical terms, she's huge. This evidence of her being of certainly "normal" size (and then some) in a prior pregnancy has been largely ignored by those who support Palin. They feel comfortable ignoring this photo for one reason: we do not know "how pregnant" Palin is here. She could hypothetically be one day away from giving birth at full term, a point she never reached with Trig, who was allegedly born at 35 weeks. Palin might be, it's suggested, one of those women who just gets really big "right at the end." The picture therefore is worthless for comparison purposes, it's claimed.
And – again – whenever this is discussed, the same group of "she got big right at the end" naysayers also serenade us with plausible tales of how they themselves, (or their wives, sisters, co-workers, what have you) never looked pregnant either. Every one of these people seems to know LOTS of 110 pound women who never looked pregnant and then, miraculously, gave birth to healthy seven, eight, even nine pound children. I am sure there are exceptions to every rule, but in fact, in nearly thirty years of working with pregnant women, I have never met one who looked significantly less pregnant on a subsequent pregnancy (unless there was a very good physiological reason, such as a single pregnancy following twins) than she did on an earlier one. It just doesn't work that way. I know, you know it, Governor Sarah Palin knows it, and deep down, every Palin supporter who tries to feed us this line of bullpuckey knows it too.
Since September, I have been hoping that additional photos of Palin from a prior pregnancy would become available which would shed some additional light on this issue. Was her pregnancy with Piper, for example, as magically free of any of those pesky physical changes as her pregnancy with Trig apparently was?
I can say now that it was not. Additional photos have been found, though regrettably they are not of the best quality. We have located two photographs of her taken in late November/early December, 2000, during her pregnancy with Piper. Both are from the archives of the Frontiersman, the local newspaper for the Mat-Su Valley.
Originals are not available. We have the photos in three separate formats, copies made from microfiche (microfiche provided by the University of Alaska), Xerox copies made from the actual extant physical copies of the paper (in person at the Frontiersman offices), and digital photographs of the physical copies of the paper (also taken in person at the Frontiersman offices.) None of these methods are ideal. Yet, in both, in spite of the fuzziness of the copies, I believe she definitely looks pregnant.
Piper was born on March 22, 2001, according to this article on her projected due date. The first week of December, therefore, Sarah Palin would have been around 25 weeks pregnant. She looks, well, normal. At twenty five weeks into her fourth pregnancy. This is, fortuitously, exactly the same point of pregnancy she would have been at when these famous "Super Tuesday" photos were taken in Juneau.
Unlike many other photos of her taken in late winter / early spring 2008, where Palin seems to be determined to hide behind winter coats, trench coats, huge (and notably unattractive) floppy print scarves, tables, podiums, mannish black blazers, and her own children, these two shots are remarkably clear. She is slim-hipped and flat-chested, and, in my opinion, she shows utterly no signs of pregnancy whatsoever.
Here are the two photos. The first, dated December 1, 2000 would have been taken sometime in the prior week, so let's say between November 24th and November 30th.
The second, dated December 5, 2000, again could have been taken any point in the prior week: between November 30th and December 4th. In this second photo, Palin is holding something – I presume a coat – draped over her left arm. Here's our original:
Here's one we sharpened to try to bring up some contrast between what she is wearing and what she is holding.
Closely examining the photo shows a slightly greenish cast to the fabric in a few places. However, as the fabric falls between her body and that of the other woman it is impossible to differentiate between what she is holding and her dark clothing, due to the fact that newspaper "half tones" scan at 85 dpi, which is a very low resolution photograph to work from.
In spite of the drawbacks of these two photos, the fullness of Palin's shape – in both photos - is impossible to deny.
Palin's supporters – the "Sarah Palin had Trig because Sarah Palin would never lie" posse – have also stated that the reason Palin never looked pregnant with Trig is that in 2007-2008 she was "in the public eye" and "did not let herself go." These photos of her pregnant with Piper demonstrate this is false. Palin was in the public eye (she was mayor of Wasilla) and was also very fit (running competitively around this point in her life). How she looked with Piper in 2000-2001 should be a very good guide to how we might have expected her to look with a fifth pregnancy several years later.
Why she didn't is anyone's guess. Mine is that she was not pregnant.
No Time for Tuckerman
-
Time. It is precious, they say. It flies, they say. And former Republican
Party Chair, former Dunleavy Chief of Staff, and now former University of
Alaska ...
1 year ago
279 comments:
«Oldest ‹Older 201 – 279 of 279Does anyone here remember the mysterious commenter (last year, I think. maybe Dec? ) who made comments stating absolutely that the key to solving everything is a connection between the Johnston/Palin families?
There was just a tone in the comment(s) that sounded like someone who knew something.
I even got excited and emailed Morgan with my opinion that this was a person who knew things.
Other than sifting back through every comment from here to Nov, I thought I'd ask if anyone had taken note. And I wondered if that person-- who it seems was right now that Levi has stepped into the spotlight-- is still here, among us.
I say, there may be nothing "simple" about Bristol x2!
Alex,
Yes! I agree with you about the mysterious commenter - I believe his/her name is "fly on the wall." You can do a search on the blog to find comments. He definitely seemed like he had insider knowledge.
TO: onething
"Another piece of evidence is the video of the family walking into church..."
A couple of threads ago, I asked Kathleen for a link to this video. She captured it around Dec. 15th.
I'll never forget the way Bristol ran into that church/school when she saw the camera!
The reason she looked PG, was because she had her hands in her pockets pushing them out. Other than that, to me, she looked thinner than she did at the RNC.
Can you publish the link, Kathleen?
Thanks!
AKPetMom: SO good to hear you say this: "I personally laughed off her campaign for Gov and thought that it was too farfetched to even be considered. How wrong I was."
Because so many smart people are still saying it! Except for your last sentence, of course. And this fits right into my tin-foil-hat comparison with a Hitler type -- how educated people regarded him before he had them -- and all of us to a huge or small degree -- by the short hairs for a number of dreadful years.
And also, I have my guilty pleasures also in reading exhaustively about certain celebrities -- JackieO, for one, because I always thought she was so v intelligent and wise (and I think I've been fully vindicated in that) and I love to know everything about the pre-WWII British artistocrats. My justification is that we could never know our own real-life friends so well, from so many angles, and speak so plainly about them as we can and do about by reading about these well-known people. Truman Capote loved and defended gossip, too, and if you've ever read his lit crit, you know that he had a very fine mind.
Anyway. Just Hi to an AK person. And thanks for your posts. I have enjoyed them a lot, always.
Also, I agree with you these there is a dark, sad resolution to this tangled tale, which may never be public.
MAINSTREAM MEDIA ALERT!
Bristol Palin is going to be interviewd on Good Morning America tomorrow morning (Wednesday, May 6). Fire up those recorders! Will someone please capture it so people who can't see it and don't record it can see it from this site?
Onething said;
"Dangerous says,
"I fail to see how anyone can doubt Bristol gave birth to Tripp at the time announced. With so many MSM outlets watching, attempting to perpetrate a ruse on that is close to impossible."
As you know, I do indeed doubt Tripp was born on 12-27, although his appearance on GVS was consistent with a baby of several weeks. I find their behavior in hiding him for 6 weeks when they so desperately needed him to appear completely incomprehensible,"
***************************
Dangerous is right, but not because of the MSM watching. It is because Levi was there for the birth. The easiest thing in the world for Levi to dispute would be that the birthdate is wrong. And he would be 100% believed by everyone. Why? Because he has said he was there during several different interviews, with no correction made by the Palin's. If I'm not mistaken, Bristol herself said that Levi was there.
There is NO WAY the Palin's could now dispute that Levi was there for the birth. That horse has left the barn!
Besides, as the father, he should be able to get his own copy of a birth certificate to prove a contrary date.
The question for the Palin's would then becomes: "Why would you fake the birthdate of Tripp?" And any house of cards, leading back to Trig, would then fall. Simple as that.
As I've said before, if you were trying to hide an absurdly-conceived (pun intended) baby conspiracy, why push the ONE person who can bring you down with ONE very simple disclosure, into a corner by aggressively trashing his family and egging on a nasty custody fight??
Now THAT is incomprehensible!
(And just saying "well, Sarah isn't rational" doesn't cut it, as far as I'm concerned.)
"onething said...
Another piece of evidence is the video of the family walking into church just before Christmas, in which Bristol looked pregnant, but did not look near term."
Where can this video be seen?
I have been going over this blog from the beginning to try and put pieces together and came across a story published on April 23, 2008 about Sarah swearing in Americorps volunteers. There is a picture of Sarah that while she is back to, she certainly doesn’t look pregnant. The story says the picture was taken “last week” Sarah was not in Juneau much of the previous week. She was there on the 13th, which was the last day of the session and flew out to Anchorage on the 14th. Diana has the event on April 10th and Audrey’s blog says a picture taken the same day was taken on April 10th. Would someone give me a link to the evidence that this event was held on the 10th? I have gone through a couple of pages of internet searches with no results so thought someone might have it easily at hand. It likely is not critical, but I am trying to fix as many dates and events as possible.
Here is a link to the story http://tiny.cc/eDtfC
Alex,
I am almost certain you are talking about the poster truth patrol. I also believe they know something. Nothing is going to happen until Sherry Johnstons court appearance occurs.
Alex said...
Does anyone here remember the mysterious commenter (last year, I think. maybe Dec? ) who made comments stating absolutely that the key to solving everything is a connection between the Johnston/Palin families? ***
That was "Fly on the Wall." I decided it was as likely a troll as an informant. If he knew something, he should tell us. If he didn't want to tell us, he could tell Audrey confidentially.
For example, Fly said to look at where someone would reroute our conversations, because we were too close to the truth. But Fly never gave any examples. I was reading every comment and I did not see this. Looking for it was a waste of time. Maybe Fly was right, but why play games with us?
I was under the impression at the time that Fly was suggesting more of a Palin/Johnston relationship than just Levi fathering Bristol's two babies. Like Bristol was really Levi's half-sister. Or Track and Sherry were TriG's parents. Maybe just that Sherry sold drugs to Diana Palin?
Fly never told us. Perhaps Fly was the one trying to re-route us. If I have misjudged you, Fly on the Wall, I apologize, and I beg you to show your sincerity by telling Audrey what you know or suspect. We're still seeking truth here.
NoMore said..."""Question: Wasn't there an announcement of Tripp whatever *Johnston* being born? . May 5,2009 12:15PM"""
The only announcement was Hearsay - the date published in the People magazine that came from the great-aunt.
There was no official announcement by the hospital (done with parental consent) or any community newspapers (done by tradition and probably with the hospital's consent form).
Even the date by People Mag was unclear: either 27 or 28 Dec 08. SP did not comment for several days. I thought the Guv was withholding because we didn't give her enough adulation when she returned to Alaska from her VP travails.
The only pictures of TriPP came out with Greta VS. In Fairbanks. That was weird.
I'm trying to imagine that if SP had given birth to TriG would she behave this way?
I remember when Meg Stapleton (who used to work as a state employee; now a flack for SarahPAC) had her baby (August 2007), the ecstatic message that SP put out about the birth.
Why didn't she publish as nice an announcement for her own daughter and "first grandchild?"
penny said...
****I say, there may be nothing "simple" about Bristol x2!***
so true and thus the baffling and circuitous mystery.
Anyone want to lay odds, now that Bristol is supposed to be some kind of spokeswoman for abstinence/pregnancy prevention, how long it is before she has a verbal "wardrobe malfunction" and accidently lets slip something as troublesome for her mother's pregnancy deception as was the picture of Levi and Trig on the Tyra Banks show and the LKL show?
(my WV is "destie" = destiny?)
I just heard that Levi is commenting on The Early Show in reaction to what Bristol is saying... Is this re what Bristol said on GMA this morning? We only get The Early Show down here, and I have to run, so please let me know what is said.
Thanks friends,
penny
B and JJ--
That's it. "Fly On The Wall."
I can't remember exactly what he/she said, but it was said with a kind of absolute tone, as if by an insider.
I'd have to go back and search every page of comments for "FOTW."
But those statements seemed oddly prescient when Levi stepped up, started talking and throwing his weight around (hooray!) Really, before then it was easy to believe Sherry J was just a plain old dope dealer and Levi was only father of one. Now. . .
Thanks for helping me not think I made it up.
now BP says her comments on GVS re: abstinence, were taken out of context. Imagine that from a Palin woman.
WV= ineed
as in I need a drink!
I'm totally loyal but was fading away for a few days because I was sure that nothing new was happening here, but now Bristol is an "advocate" again.
What is the deal with these people? They say that the media is against them then do everything possible to get interviews and keep their names out there.
As far as "Candie's foundation" goes, showing a girl who has love and family support and lots of financial resources won't scare anyone---boo hoo, Bristol looses time with her friends and it's "Hard" If they really want to make the message stick, have a girl talk about how she was kicked out of the house, left with no resources, was abandoned by the father of the baby. The Candie's foundation is a noble cause but they need to rethink promoting Bristol as a spokes person. Nothing turns a teen off more than a hypocrite and the Palin family is taking hypocrisy to a whole new low.
This is a joke.
my wv: culnedw, which is total nonsense.
I agree that the "abstinence is the only thing that works" (except that it doesn't work) message is nonsensical coming from Bristol. What a joke these people are!
It's also pretty funny that Tripp was wearing the same overalls that Trig had on at the RNC, and they showed that photo (of Bristol with Trig) when talking about teenage pregnancy. Sure makes it easy to make the connection of Bristol-Trig-Tripp. Certainly there are some interesting double entendres.
In the end, using Bristol as a spokesperson for abstinence will be revealed as the penultimate hypocrisy, outdone only by Sarah's award-winning performance before the right-to-life crowd about her moment of temptation when she found out Trig had DS. These performances will make clear that Sarah is not only a liar but did so for her own political gain (not to protect Bristol) and is thus a complete fraud. I doubt it will play well with her base.
pearlygirl, when I heard Bristol repeat "hard work" over and over, it sounded just like our former pResident's peevish use of the term.
If BP is out to influence other teens, showing herself with a loyal father seated at her side, a sound-asleep baby on her lap, professionally made-up, appearing on a national television show, flying around and staying in a nice hotel all expenses paid... well, what would someone very young--and possibly dumb--think? That their unintended pregnancy would be just as glam as Bristol's?
And what is Tripp going to think when he gets old enough to have friends who can show him on YouTube that his grandfather thinks he was a "mistake"?
In Sarah’s speech in Iowa last month, she said when she learned her child had Down’s Syndrome, she considered "for a fleeting moment" having an abortion. However a New York Times article published on October 13, 2008 had this statement.
“Her references to her son are the most personal part of her speech, as she describes being scared when she first learned that the baby would have special needs. She and her husband, Todd, talked, prayed, reflected and ultimately decided to have the child.”
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/10/14/us/politics/14palin.html
While the latter is not a direct quote, those are two dramatically different statements. I suspect the latter would not be as attractive to her right to life audience in Iowa. Does anyone have a video or transcript of what the Times was reporting?
Mrs.TarquinBiscuitbarrel said:
"And what is Tripp going to think when he gets old enough to have friends who can show him on YouTube that his grandfather thinks he was a "mistake"?"
I'm no fan of defending the Palins, but in the interest of fairness I'll defend Todd against this statement. When he said "this mistake she had here over a year ago," I believe he was referring to the sex act that produced Tripp, and not Tripp himself since he's only four months old.
He did NOT call Tripp a mistake.
Our quibbles about the Palins are substantial enough without twisting what they say into something they did not.
Of course, we can argue over whether all day long over whether having unprotected sex is a "mistake" or an act of stupidity. But that's another topic altogether.
Bristol's voice is enough like her mother's that it's painful to listen to, but I sucked it up and watched not only Bristol and the Enforcer (aka Todd) on GMA, but also the response by the Talking Lump (aka Levi--seriously, I feel sorry for him, but the poor guy is not bright.)
First of all, for a company that uses sex to sell to teens to have an "abstinence prevention promotion" is such a Machiavellian tactic (tax deductible, of course) that, where do you start? For a governor and her daughter to associate themselves with that company is just, eeowww!
Secondly, Bristol goes on TV and talks about her sex life, about having a baby, changing diapers, bottle feedings, etc, and yet when asked about her baby's father she says, "I'm not here to talk about my personal life." WTF??
Thirdly, watching her cuddling that cute little baby had me thinking, Oh, I miss those days. I'm looking forward to my daughters having babies so I can cuddle them and give them bottles, etc, etc." And this releasing of maternal hormones is supposed to dissuade teenagers from having babies HOW? Like they didn't know until Bristol told them that babies aren't just an accessory on your hip, that they're work? Just because the Palins are dumb doesn't mean the rest of the world is equally clueless.
And, finally, all this talk about bottle feeding Tripp tells us that Trig was also bottle fed. Any woman who was dedicated enough to breast feed a DS baby (which is reportedly difficult), would surely breast feed her second child, too. So that strange, bolster-like bosom that Bristol displayed at the GOP convention was either caused by her pregnancy (interestingly, she shows the same bosom in the family Christmas photos, but in all other photos--and now--seems considerably more flat chested) or was part of an attempt to make her look more pregnant than se really was.
Sometimes I feel like screaming at these nitwits, "Tell us the truth already and then just GO AWAY!!"
Penny,
The Levi video on GMA can be found here:
http://palingates.blogspot.com/2009/05/levi-sex-and-reality.html
Fair point, Morgan. Todd did say that Bristol "made a mistake more than a year ago." None of us can go to the video of our own grandparents making that sort of remark about us. Unfortunately, Tripp will be able to.
After viewing the ideo of the GMA interview with Bristol from this morning, I have a few thoughts:
1. She really is uncomfortable with public speaking. Part of it is being a teenager, I'm sure. She just hasn't developed much skill yet to be able to verbalize her thoughts and think on her feet. I'd don't think it is as Orwellian as being told to only repeatedly say one thing. I think she is just very self-conscious about saying the right things, and fears saying something "stupid" (no, not something "secret").
2. Something stupid, like that she was taken out of context about telling Greta that abstinence alone is not very realistic!! Um, yeah, you did say that Bristol! And then you agreed when Greta reitertated her comment.
That was just dopey to try to disavow that statement. I wonder if she felt she had to defend her current comments about astinence-only, and she panicked about how to reconcile her prior statements.
3. Then Bristol comes back on with the rest of her interview with Neil Cole from the Candie's Foundation, and she then agrees that a "middle ground" should be reached between no teen sex and protected sex! And Neil Cole affirms that broader goal as well.
I'd guess someone reminded her inbetween interview segments that its okay to bend a little from the strict no-sex ideal.
Awkward....
4. This was meant to be a softball interview to help promote this Foundation. So anyone who was hoping for a 60 Minutes-style grilling of Bristol was doomed to be disappointed.
I am going to go out on a limb here and disagree with Fearless Moderator, Morgan. I think that Todd's comment can be read several different ways. He is not a well rehearsed, practiced speaker, and he certainly did not choose his words well. If he meant to say that the mistake was having unprotected sex more than a year ago, then he should have said, "mistake made then." We know that he was not a college graduate, so his language skills may be a little lacking here (I'm trying to be kind).
However, I was taken by the fact that his gaze was fixed on his grandson, and Matt had already begun the interview by asking if Tripp was a mistake. Looking at Tripp, saying "mistake here" bothers me, and I'm sure he'd like to take that comment back. It raises too many eyebrows. The alternative "mistake over a year ago" just might be the "other grandson" that we are all thinking about.
They also haven't gotten all of their lines down yet. At one moment, Bristol speaking about the zonked-out baby said that he was so good, yet she is also "up with him all night" for what seems to be more than a couple of nights. That's not so good. Constantly mixing bottles-- why isn't (wasn't) she nursing, considering those magnificent bolster pictures we saw at the convention??
In summary, her glib "It's hard work" hardly seems the message to make teenagers refrain from having sex. And, it is no service at all to avoid mentioning any form of birth control. It's truly sad that Bristol and Levi have to play their spat out in public, in scripted TV appearances and in the tabloid pages. Those are real family values.
Craig said, "The easiest thing in the world for Levi to dispute would be that the birthdate is wrong. And he would be 100% believed by everyone."
I agree that Levi knows the correct date. I believe this is one of the things he is hanging over the Palins' heads as a threat. "Let me take Tripp home or the world will know when he was born and will assume you lied to cover the fact that Bristol gave birth to TriG."
I anyone convinced that TriPP as seen this morning is over 4 months old? Couldn't he be 3 months old instead?
I saw a little of GMA with Bristol on this morning. Before she appeared they gave some statistics on teenage pregnancy - 80% of teenage pregnant girls don't marry the father, 50% or more don't even finish high school - thousands of thousands of teenage girls get pregnant each year etc.
I would think that Bristol would have at least waited to get a high school diploma before promoting something that she herself said was 'unrealistic'.
It's really time for the MSM to start asking this family the 'hard' questions. The hypocrisy of the Palin family is the best I've seen.
MsTarquinBiscuitbarrel. Please. Not all of us were the result of planned pregnancies. And not all of us have had kids who were planned. I'm thinking quite a few people don't need a videotape to know their parents accidentally got pregnant. And I'm sure even if they've been told this they know the difference between their parents saying, "I made a mistake" and "You are a mistake."
To MLewis, no Todd is not a college graduate but education and social status have no bearing on how nervous one can be in an interview, especially a live one. As a reporter I interviewed well-educated people who instantly began to bungle their words as soon as they saw me pick up my pen.
I think we can nitpick the Palins to death and read foul motive into everything they say. But I think when we do we risk looking as petty as we claim they are.
I take issue with much of what the Palins have said about their children. This particular statement by Todd regarding his daughter's pregnancy is not one of them.
Far be it from me to disagree with our esteemed moderator, but parents and grandparents both need to be VERY CAREFUL to NEVER say anything that can be twisted and construed by children to think that they were unwanted, and uttering the word "mistake" however it is phrased falls into that category. This is every child's secret dread (along with being abandoned--they go hand in hand).
I once, in the grip of strong emotion at a very low point in my life, said something to the effect that MAYBE someone who came from as dysfunctional a family as mine SHOULD never have had children. I hastened to explain that I did not regret having my children, that they were the lights of my life, that I was only frustrated that I wasn't a better mother. No matter. The fifteen-year-old "child" I said this to has never forgotten it, and is still convinced she was unwanted (and she was planned, right down to the month of her birth).
So I agree with those who said that Bristol and Todd's words are going to hurt Tripp in the future, and hurt him deeply. All this yapping is for Sarah's political future, and to hell with whoever they hurt in the process. These people are despicable.
Midnightcajun,
Of course everyone's mileage will vary on this issue, but I'd wager that at one time or another we've all said something that has hurt our children's feelings. Or we've heard our parents say things that hurt ours.
It really is impossible to say things that can't be twisted, but it's the intent that matters. You know very well that you didn't mean your comment the way your child interpreted it. And I'm quite sure Todd Palin did not mean for his statement to be twisted, either.
He may very well regret his gaffe, but the implication that he meant it as people are shading it is just plain unfair.
Your point actually proves mine, which is while people will put their own spin on things we should - when it's pointed out - be big enough to give them the benefit of the doubt.
There is a danger of becoming the reflection of the thing we hate and sometimes I worry that we are collectively edging in that direction with our anger towards the Palins. Granted we are all frustrated with the reluctance of the MSM to investigate this, but piling on does nothing to help. If anything it makes us look desperate.
The bigger issue here, in my opinion, is how it appears that this girl has become a pawn in her parents attempts to salvage her mother's political career.
She should have been pressed on just how she thinks she was taken out of context on her earlier remarks about abstinence not being realistic.
As folks have pointed out, Bristol is an adult and should be made accountable for such retractions of position.
Bristol should have been prepared with all the facts about teen pregnancy. She needs to know her subject, to know all sides and state her position without wavering.
Using her as a celebrity is cheap. Major networks should be ashamed for participating in this. Fluff only hurts the problem they claim they want to help.
She did get some cash out of the deal but boy this makes her look bad.
Well, it didn't hurt my feelings when my parents told me my mother was pregnant when they got married.
Was it a mistake? I don't think so.
My son was conceived after my wife and I got married, and it was a mistake. I don't think he cares though.
I think we should all leave Bristol and her activities ALONE. No matter what she does or will do in the near future, there will be a spin doctor to leap upon every particle of it, as for all celebrities, and say why it was wrong, foolish, or otherwise not suitable.
Her activities are neither our business nor germane to our mission here, which is to prove that SP WAS NOT PREGNANT.
Everything else may be good, bad, or indifferent, but let's back off, folks!
MYOB. Mind OUR own business, that is. Which is to address the one fact that we know has been misrepresented -- SP was NOT pregnant with Trig -- and that serves as a giant symbol for all the other Palin-gates and all that is wrong with SP in politics representing any of us, whether those in AK or in the entire US.
I just read this at people.com. I don't remember hearing this in the interview but may have missed it:
Bristol dropped out of high school to give birth to Tripp, but continued to take classes online. She will graduate with her high school class later this month, and told Lauer she wants to begin taking college classes soon and complete her education.
Morgan said..."...in the interest of fairness I'll defend Todd against this statement. When he said "this mistake she had here over a year ago," I believe he was referring to the sex act that produced Tripp, and not Tripp himself since he's only four months old.
Did Todd Palin really say that? (I just listened again to the video, and yes, he did!) If you take that statement literally, he COULD have been talking about Trig.
You'd think he'd say "this mistake she did here over a year ago" if he was talking about the act of conception.
In other words, I agree with mlewis' take on this topic @ 11:26 AM, and I don't think we're nitpicking.
My opinion is that if enough Palins grant interviews when they're not directly under Sarah's thumb or that of her henchwoman, someone will slip -- and I think Todd just did.
(howdoya like THIS WV? "explugs" -- that would be Levi's TV appearances)
MrsTarquinBiscuitbarrel said...
Fair point, Morgan. Todd did say that Bristol "made a mistake more than a year ago."
None of us can go to the video of our own grandparents making that sort of remark about us.
Unfortunately, Tripp will be able to.
I believe that Tripp will grow up knowing that he is loved by his family.Even if he is shown
this video in later years I doubt if he will think his grandfather doesn,t love him or that
he meant that he was a mistake.
Probably by the time he,s old enough to see this video and understand it, all of this will
have blown over and be long forgotten.
Hopefully by that time his grandma will be long forgotten.
Sorry if this is OT: Tripp has been with Bristol for two different interview that I know.
Mr. Lauer said he was 'out cold' and Bristol said it was 'exhaustion.'
If you watch the newest video he doesn't react at all. I'd like to hear from mothers with experience and professionals about how normal this is for a baby his age. I get a sick feeling watching her tweak him and there is not the slightest twitch. When the camera was pulled back he looks weird and stiff. I'm not a baby expert, it could just be my little experience with babies.
I know this is not pleasant, for Tripp's sake responsible adults need to make certain he is alright.
Andrew Sullivan rented a tuxedo today to attend the White House Correspondences Dinner on Sunday after learning that Sarah Palin might attend. The presence of Mr. Sullivan in the same room as Palin reminds the MSM that they still need to ask Palin some serious questions about Trig's birth when she agrees to an interview again.
"Of course, we can argue over whether all day long over whether having unprotected sex is a "mistake" or an act of stupidity."
In fairness, those are not mutually exclusive positions.
mnyobpres, a blogger at HUFF-POST said it best:
***Politics is an art of power. Politics will make you use anything and anyone to capitalize on your dreams and goals.
***Nothing is off limits....
Bristol is just a pawn in the game of Palin's political goals and dreams. ***
muah,
my 21 y. o. daughter just said, 'that baby is drugged,' when KO showed the segment of SP with tripp.
muah said...
If you watch the newest video he doesn't react at all. I'd like to hear from mothers with experience and professionals about how normal this is for a baby his age. ***
If Bristol just flew in from Alaska with TriPP and he didn't sleep much during the flights, he could be exhausted. Or someone could have given him Benedryl so that he would sleep through the interview, rather than be fussy as with Greta.
I don't think Bristol's behavior is off limits for discussion now that she is a paid teenage spokesmother for teenage abstinence.
As part of her new paid gig, she publicly discussed her personal life on TV this morning. She is now, in my opinion, a public figure earning a living from a company that uses teen erotica to sell their products.
Some examples of Candies ads are on this mudflats thread:
http://www.themudflats.net/2009/05/05/celebrating-mixed-messages/
http://www.chron.com/photos/1999/07/05/12180549/260xStory.jpg
Muah...I totally agree! I didn't see the GMA interview, but I did watch the Today Show interview and thought the same thing! Tripp looked like a rubber doll. (I'm not saying that Bristol was actually holding a doll, people, so don't flame me.) Something was not right there.
I agree with Morgan that we can't make too much of Todd saying a "mistake"
By no means would I classify anyone in the Palin Clan a great parent, but even really really great and considerate parents say and do things that inadvertently hurt their children.----That's what therapy is for ;-)
Also to build on my boo hoo for Bristol remark, I became a mom at 35, college grad and married. It was/is still "hard" and I didn't get time to spend with my friends either. Motherhood is and will always be both rewarding and challenging no matter what your age. Bristol deserves no more accolades for being "strong and brave" than any other mom out there. Let's face it--we all deserve a little pat on the back for being a mother biologically or spiritually. By the way, happy mother's day in advance to all of us out there with a big cheer for the partners and family who support them. I'm proud of being a mom but I would not make it without my husband, friends, and somewhat insane but loving extended family.
to Muah: Babies can totally pass out and be oblivious to even extremely noisy surroundings, but why does no Palin baby ever fuss in an interview? Being asleep now and then is one thing, but all the time? It's like they were born to be great props. Perhaps they schedule things around "nap" times.
my wv: goindy as in Go indy. Perhaps we'll see an independent documentary of this drama--or it's a plug for the indy 500
Well, Tripp does seem awfully sleepy which in my experience was the way it was in the earliest months and not so much later on. I could take my babies anywhere, even loud places, when they were a month or two old but then they became much more alert and interested in what was going on around them. I don't think the fact that he was unresponsive is anything to worry about especially if he's younger than the official version of his birth.
my wv is nosig--no significance?!
So in the video of Levi on tv this morning they flashed the picture of him with a baby wearing the same overalls as Tripp is wearing in the Bristol interview this morning. I guess this is supposed to be an earlier picture of Tripp yet he seems to fit into the overalls just the same way. And it's the picture where Levi is wearing a ring. What are we looking at?
"I anyone convinced that TriPP as seen this morning is over 4 months old? Couldn't he be 3 months old instead?"
I thought he looked huge. And I'm the one who doesn't think he was born on 12-27. But I have to call 'em like I see 'em.
I myself was the result of my parents desperate attempt to follow the Catholic Church and use rhythm method. After I was born, my mother got a diaphragm and changed her church.
WV: phictiv, as in we are dealing here with fictive accounts.
Muah
I also found Tripp’s lack of response troubling. If he was “exhausted” why not let him sleep in some quiet place instead of bringing him into a situation with bright lights and noise? IMO this is just a page from Sarah’s book of using children as props.
It seemed to me that Bristol had been told to show “love” to Tripp and so she kept touching him even though it was clear all he really wanted to do was sleep, Very strange.
Okay--am I the only one who's a little weirded out by Bristol having this conversation/interview with her DAD sitting next to her on the couch?
I mean, when I was a teenager, I couldn't even stand to be in the room with my Dad if a maxi pad commercial was on TV--and here they sit, just blabbing on about this topic like it's the weather. And most teenage girls I know (the ones who live with both parents, anyway--not ones who don't have a "choice" of who to talk to), wouldn't be real comfortable taking about this with their Dad as their "wingman."
Maybe it's just me. But, as with everything else about this family....it's just WEIRD.
@muah: RE Tripp not moving. That is so weird. Before the piece aired, there was a quick shot of Todd holding Tripp. He was awake and alert. Then the Today show went to commercial, and I had to go to work, so I didn't get to see the interview. But to see the pics & vid of Tripp now really bugs me, since I know the kid had just been awake!
From one of the ABC interviews:
Palin said son Tripp, born in December, is sitting up, rolling over and starting to giggle.
Clearly the motionless TriPP wasn't doing any of that on TV.
But what age would such a child be?
Was Bristol reciting a script of what a 4 month old can do? Or was she describing what her perhaps 3 month old baby actually does?
Child development specialists?
The worst part was when Bristol said something about
"getting the whole education thing over with"......
Thanks to Mary we can now give a link to a pdf file of the Alaska Business Magazine which includes a new photo from the "Palin Christmas 2007" series taken on September 14th 2007.
http://www.box.net/shared/sbx0z6eo66
NYT's GAIL COLLINS:
... surely, when it comes to combating teen pregnancy, the Palin family has done enough damage already. What worse message could you send to teenage girls than the one they delivered at the Republican convention: If your handsome but somewhat thuglike boyfriend gets you with child, he will clean up nicely, propose marriage, and show up at an important family event wearing a suit and holding your hand. At which point you will get a standing ovation.
Now a single mom on the outs with the father of her baby, Bristol wants a new kind of happy ending.
“I just want to go out there and promote abstinence and say this is the safest choice,” she said on “Good Morning America.”
“It’s not going to work,” said her ex-boyfriend, Levi Johnston, in a dueling early-morning interview.
If you have ever watched Levi Johnston on TV for two minutes you will appreciate how terrifying it is when he has the most reasonable analysis of a social issue.
Because Bristol’s own philosophy seems, at minimum, tentative, it’s hard to tell whether she believes that cheerleading for abstinence should be coupled with education about birth control methods.
...
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/07/opinion/07collins.html?_r=1&th&emc=th
apparently the CANDIE FOUNDATION is as hypocritical as BP, their new spoke-person.
here's their new tight tank top, with this slogan (I AM SEXY ENOUGH TO KEEP YOU WAITING) printed large over the chest area!
isn't this a huge contradiction to send to young teen girls? promoting their sexuality while advocating abstinence?
this whole thing is a nauseating spectacle! this family together does not a whole brain make.
http://www.candiesfoundation.org/tshirts.html
Finally forced myself to watch yesterday's interviews, knowing full well that Bristol's responses would be depressingly scripted - she didn't disappoint, neither did Todd. But I was immediately struck by the way Bristol's "smile" resembles her mother's - that forced, grimace-y way she pulls the corners of her mouth back, when she says something fabricated because it's what she thinks she's supposed to say.... SO insincere, superficial, artificial, and just plain creepy!
Also, too, if you look at the PDF from Alaska Business Mag (see Kathleen on 5/7 at 4:16AM) with the photo of the Palin family along the banister, ask yourself which woman is most plausibly pregnant. Hmmm....
"Palin Christmas 2007" pics...ruh roh!
I didn't realize the connection between the foundation and the clothing company. A foundation discouraging teen pregnancy looked noble on the surface but apparently, the foundation was only started due to backlash against the racy clothing and ads. Talk about sending mixed messages! Those ads are soft porn. The message of it being okay to wait is a good one, but abstinence cannot be the only option. I noticed that one (and only one) shirt said "strong" if you click on other styles and that's a great message. However the other t-shirts with sexy this and sexy that like the new slogan "sexy enough to keep you waiting" are like waving a red flag in front of a bull---nothing turns a guy on more than a "challenge"
The foundation feels totally creepy now. Maybe it is a good match with the Palins.
went to MUDFLATS to check the outrageous CANDIE ad... that company is much worse than i thought!
a blogger there posted this
Actongue Says:
May 6th, 2009 at 9:17 AM
Interesting information on Red States and Teen pregancy
http://www.getlisty.com/fox11az/highest-teen-pregnancy-rates/
1. Mississippi: 68.4%
2. New Mexico: 64.1
3. Texas: 63.1
4. Arkansas: 62.3
5. Arizona: 62.0
6. Oklahoma: 59.6
7. Nevada: 55.8
8. Tennessee: 54.7
9. Kentucky: 54.6
10.Georgia: 54.2
Interesting on how many of them are RED STATES
Lowest
The lowest teen birth rates continue to be in New England, where three states have teen birth rates at just half the national average.
From Kathleen: Thanks to Mary we can now give a link to a pdf file of the Alaska Business Magazine which includes a new photo from the "Palin Christmas 2007" series taken on September 14th 2007.
http://www.box.net/shared/sbx0z6eo66
*************************************
Interesting to compare Bristol's appearance in the "Christmas 2007" family photo to these pics taken yesterday:
http://tinyurl.com/coxmcp
(Using Firefox you can right-click and zoom in on the photo in the Alaska Bus Mag PDF to get a better view)
I don't usually comment on irrelevancies, such as what Bristol Palin reads from a script about anything.
They are clearly trying hard to make lemonade from the lemons they've received from the situation, but the drink is just as sour since they have nothing to sweeten it.
It seems to me that the Palins are simply trying to change the subject, keeping the focus on Bristol and her child when the real controversy surrounds Trig. That's a classic legal/PR tactic to feed the beast.
If you stand back and consider the Palin's reaction to the arrival of both babies, you see that they are far more circumspect about Trig than Tripp. SP's supposed pregnancy with Trig was a closely- guarded secret, although there would be nothing embarrassing about it. Bristol's pregnancy with Tripp, however, was purportedly an open secret and they talked endlessly about it, both before and after, despite the do-as-I-say-not-as-I-do nature of the conversation right now.
Someone should ask whether Willow has observed the abstinence-only rule, since she is now close the Bristol's age when she started having sex (if not earlier). Maybe there are two teen girls in the Palin household for whom abstinence-only didn't work.
Dangerous
Reading your comments about the comatose TriPP, the word "Benadryl" popped into my mind, too.
Gives a whole new meaning to the phrase, "Dryl, Baby, Dryl"
The photo from the Alaska Business Magazine - Wow!! That's very telling. Great find!!
Thanks so much to Mary for the pdf of the Alaska Business Mag article with the Christmas '07 photo - and to MomME for the photo from yesterday. It's stunning how bulging and bursting through the middle Bristol looks in the Christmas photo - while the Gov is wearing a small little fitted jacket that hangs straight down across her flat stomach. Nothing but nothing about the gov indicates pregnancy - not her middle, not her bustline, not her face while Bristol is bulging on all fronts.
Meanwhile, in the photo of Bristol from yesterday, she's got a modest bustline and a little, nipped-in flat waist post-baby (babies) just as one would expect an 18-yr-old to have.
"Dryl, Baby, Dryl"
Punkinbugg, I laughed out loud! Bet that's what they used at teh RNC to keep TriG quiet & "perfect."
Dangerous said,
"[T]hey are far more circumspect about Trig than Tripp. . . . Bristol's pregnancy with Tripp, however, was purportedly an open secret and they talked endlessly about it, both before and after."
Exactly. Now do you see why their NOT announcing TriPP's birth promptly and NOT showing any pictures till mid-Feb. with Greta, suggest that there was NO TriPP to show? Pesuasive evidence of TriPP's birth on 12/27/08 could have confirmed the campaign's argument that Bristol was 5 mos. along at the RNC. Privacy, my a##.
Kathleen has already posted the link to the PDF-file with the "lost" official Palin family Christmas picture from 2007.
I have now created an album on my flickr-account in which I have combined all those photos which we have recently found of the big Palin family photo shoot, which happened either on the 13th September (says the photographer) or on the 14th September (says SP's official schedule). In any case, this is extremely interesting. The link is:
http://tinyurl.com/dzqyod
I have contrasted those pictures from September 2007, which show a surprisingly "bulky" Bristol with the pictures of her we got from myspace, taken in June 2007, just three months earlier. In these pictures she looks very skinny.
One justified question is why the Christmas picture which was taken on the steps in the Juneau mansion in September 2007 was not widely released. The answer seems pretty obvious if you take a good look on Bristol's belly.
Patrick (PD research)
Well my eyes just filled with tears. I posted yesterday that in my experience, babies who are "exhausted" are fidgety, "fussy", irritable until they are in more familiar and quieter surroundings and drop off to sleep. I felt yesterday that the baby was drugged and after reading so many comments here from people who made a similar observation, I am just saddened to think that I may be right. How could the interviewers allow such a thing. You don't normally say about a sleeping baby that "he is out cold."
Patrick,
Thanks so much for the album link for Sept 2007.
I've thought as soon as I saw the official pic on the governor's site(and you can use the handy-dandy magnifier right up on her belly) that Bristol looked preg then. Comparing that to the MySPace and to yesterday's teen preg press things surely does make one think. The additional shots of her in that camo dress just add to my previous opinion--sitting down makes the pudge pretty obvious (sorry Bristol). So, then, how pregnant do we think she is on Sept 13/14th of 2007? If THAT is her first pregnancy (still think she looks pregnant in that green sweater one too which is supposedly fall of 2006--yikes) then I'd think she'd have to be at least 2 or 3 months? She does seem kinda thicker overall so she could be farther along even than that...maybe? Such that a late Feb early March 35wk premie is still in the running?
I'd like to share my own 'clueless' preg story to show how if people aren't really paying attention, they just DO NOT NOTICE STUFF.
A mom acquaintence of mine who I knew to be pregnant with twins recently gave birth, and I didn't notice. Yes. I knew she was pregnant, but did not know the due date, and, she didn't look all that large yet, and I was wondering to myself a few times "gee I wonder how big she's gonna get towards the end" and the next thing I know, there she is, looing a little smaller than I remembered, and I wondered to myself 'huh, I wonder if she lost the babies'? But I'm not about to ask her about it in case she did. So then, I hear someone say she just had the twins (apparently over spring break).
See? If you're not paying attention, you don't ask questions, and you mind your own business, lots of stuff goes on. I'm assuming that a LOT of Alaskans just don't care that much about these preg details of GINO and Bristol, just like I really wasn't aware that someone I see maybe once a month in passing could gestate and deliver and I didn't even notice!!
But boy did I feel like an idiot, and I've had three babies (one at a time) myself!
I mostly agree with Amy1 about leaving Bristol alone, but I do think hints of the timelines of her one or two pregnancies are relevant.
She is thin with non-flat belly in green sweater photo in 2006.
She is thin but with belly not observable in MySpace photos.
She is thick in the middle with fatter face in Sept. 2007.
She is thin again with belly not observable in the summer of 2008, in the blue parka photo with Sarah, TriG, and sisters.
She is enormous everywhere, including broad face, a few (or 6?) weeks later at the RNC.
She looks mid-pregnancy or recently post-partum sideways in Feb. 2009 at Iron Dog.
She is still not thin in face or trunk with Greta.
Now in early May 2009 she is very thin all over, her face returning to the MySpace photo size.
I think this means the only thin photos we've seen are spring 2007, summer 2008, and spring 2009. We've seen no photos between 9/07 and maybe 7/08. (Did Bristol even go to TriG's baby shower?)
Tip of the hat to Patrick, pictures are worth thousands of words. Especially the pictures of Bristol sitting down-- there's no mistaking that little belly. Compared to similar photos of Sarah sitting down, it's not even a close guess as to which gal might be expecting. I would like to suggest adding the current photo of attractive, slim Bristol taken with her new abstinence friend. There is one of her at
www.usmagazine.com/node/25726
Great slideshow, Patrick.
SP: Leaning WAAAY over at the waist, even though she's expecting her FIFTH child, holding Red Bull and Pepsi.
BP: A mere 3 months after her MySpace boat ride, she is at least 10-20 lbs heavier with a double chin and an unfortunate dress.
You tell me: Who's pregnant again?
"I have contrasted those pictures from September 2007, which show a surprisingly "bulky" Bristol with the pictures of her we got from myspace, taken in June 2007, just three months earlier. In these pictures she looks very skinny."
I think it's because Bristol was pregnant twice when Sarah was not. But there's nothing here that can't be explained away by "Bristol has had to struggle with her weight a bit." As for Sarah, even if she was pregnant, in Mid-Sept 07 with a claimed due date of May 08, she would have been only a month into the pregnancy. There would be no reason for her to be showing anything at that point.
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