Here's the background. Last winter, as we reviewed myriad videos, we noticed a brief segment in a Canadian Broadcast Company report that they had done on Palin - and quite explicitly - the Trig baby question way way back on September 3rd. I had watched the video countless times back in September of '08, as my investigation was just beginning but I had not watched it, as of last winter, in months.
However, as we were going through old material looking for something - anything - we might have missed, the segment jumped out at us, because we realized that Gov. Palin was wearing what we had come to call "scarf chic," her standard "pregnancy" uniform, yet it was footage we had never analyzed or dated. We were pretty sure it had to be from 2008, due to the star in the window (indicating that she has a child in service) because Track had not yet enlisted in the winter of 2007. It's also her office in Juneau - we're sure about that. But when during that winter?
Here's the CBC segment. The entire thing is worth watching - it's uncanny how the questions about Trig's birth were laid out so fully by the CBC back on September 3rd. However, the footage we were interested in is roughly between 2:10 and 2:20.
Here are some screen shots from this footage:
This is from the 2:11 point in the video. Note that the furniture behind her is visible between her jacket and her scarf.Here's another shot:
Again, it's clear there's no sign of impending motherhood here.
Unfortunately, we were never able to date this footage from available sources, and it got pushed to the back burner.
Until today. Why? Well, footage from the same date turned up very prominently at the beginning of Keith Olbermann's segment on Sarah Palin last night.
Visit msnbc.com for Breaking News, World News, and News about the Economy
Now, this struck me as odd. A curious choice to say the least. Why would a network, with access to literally hundreds of hours of stock footage of Gov. Palin from the election and since, as part of a major segment on a major show (Countdown with Keith Olbermann) use obscure and outdated footage of her from another network? And place it quite prominently IN the show? I don't have an answer. But to say that I find it intriguing is an understatement.
Here's a screen grab from this footage:
I think it should be obvious to everyone why we'd like to date this meeting.
211 comments:
1 – 200 of 211 Newer› Newest»FYI, the first video won't play. It says "invalid parameters" when I try to play it. The second one plays fine.
I just tested both videos (on a Mac with Firefox) and they are both playing for me. Here's a link to the first video if it continues to not play for some folks:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A7Coy1OAQXY
I posted this in the other thread but I'll post it here, too.
If she was hanging that flag in the window PRIOR to Track's deployment (9/11/08) then she could have been hanging it at any point AFTER he enlisted (9/11/07).
The outfit, the make-up, the hair are all classic Palin "hiding my pregnancy" look and the flag can take us as far back as September of '07.
That same office scene is at 0:58 on this video, the MSNBC most recent inerview with Levi.
Oooooh good one, Audrey!
YOUR picture from February 12th, 2008 could be put up as a side-by-side comparison.
It looks the same, except, the little pictures on the credenza are rearranged, and the flags are different.
BUT --- WHY would K.O. show that footage? It had nothing to do with what he was saying - that she had QUIT the oil and gas commission in less than a year - perhaps it was a shot across her bow?
Correcting myself. The flags aren't swapped. That is the Alaska flag in both pics...
Does anyone have an account to access Anchorage Daily News archives? I found this in a Google search:
Apr 1, 2008 - The half-hour meeting was cordial, with lots of smiles and laughter, but with a serious undercurrent. Palin sat at a long boardroom table in her third-floor Capitol office with her chief of staff, Mike Tibbles, budget director Karen Rehfeld and legislative director Russ Kelly. ...
From Palin sharpens her veto ax - BUDGET: Legislators meet with governor to … - Related web pages
docs.newsbank.com/g/GooglePM/AS/lib00548 ...
Author: WESLEY LOY
wloy@adn.com
Staff
Date: April 1, 2008
Publication: Anchorage Daily News (AK)
Page: A1
Word count: 829
For more than a week, state lawmakers have been filing into Gov. Sarah Palin's office to explain themselves.
The lawmakers have hometown projects they want to fund -- everything from road improvements to baseball batting cages. And they're hoping Palin won't veto them as she did last year.
The meetings, open to reporters, offer an extraordinary glimpse into the state budgeting process as well as the tenuous relationship between the governor and [Read article (fee)]
I think the lady with the straight hair is Karen Rehfeld:
http://www.daylife.com/photo/0aoWd2q5O24hw?q=Sarah+Palin
Jennifer
WV: Rallyst
(Sorry, I am bored and posting waaaay more than usual)
Here is a photo of the same outfit (I think) but at the Republican Governors meeting in DC:
http://newsminer.com/photos/2008/feb/25/636/
Jennifer
Hooray CBC -- and Audrey and team. It's reassuring to know not everyone in the media was asleep at the wheel during that time. Can't wait to hear more.
(Maybe CBC will be the one to address this issue further?!)
Mike Tibbles was chief of staff through May 2, 2008.
She's wearing what appears to be a similar outfit in a photo sometime around March 5, 2008.
There's some kind of powerpoint presentation on-screen with Alaska map.
Palin's chief of staff, Mike Tibbles, resigns
The Associated Press
Published Friday, May 2, 2008
JUNEAU -- Gov. Sarah Palin's Chief of Staff Mike Tibbles has resigned.
Palin accepted Tibbles' resignation while announcing several other changes to her administration on Thursday.
Tibbles has worked for Palin since she took office in December 2006, working through two regular legislative sessions and two special sessions.
He did not immediately return phone messages. It is not immediately known what Tibbles will be doing next or why he stepped down.
No successor has been named, but Palin's deputy chief of staff Mike Nizich will serve as the interim chief until one is named.
http://www.gov.state.ak.us/large_photo.php?id=110
March 05, 2008
Gov. Sarah Palin appointed Steve Haagenson of Fairbanks today as the new Energy Coordinator for the State of Alaska.
TRy march 12, 2009. See http://thebookofsarah.blogspot.com and the specific entry where she thanks the troops. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y0U79Fl9NEk&feature=player_embedded Same outfit, same hair, my guess is whenever she recorded the message (which was posted on youtube March 12) may likely be the same day.
in looking further the actual recording date appears to perhaps be Feb 23rd... not sure as this was filmed in her office.
ACtual Sarah message in video..."We love you. We're so thankful for you. We're praying for you. Come home safe. Come home sound." From the National Governors Association winter meeting, February 23, 2008, Washington, DC. To lea...
Amazing report from the Canadians. Can you just write them and ask the date of their 'file footage'? Certainly they know where they got it.
I am interested in what Bristol says when Trig is introduced, I can't lip read that and don't know if it is important, but Bristol's face certainly looks like she knows a lie is being told.
And what does MacLeod say about bumping into Sarah 'a week before she gave birth'? Did she look pregnant then? This would be the first week in March 08.
Can the video be dated by the people in the room with her? What she is wearing? Sunlight?
I hope the CBC can date the footage, and why did Keith use it?
Hmmmm
Well, you have to admit, there isn't a whole lot of footage of her looking like she's governing. This is a meeting and she moves her hand a bit, looking like she's making some sort of point. Not a lot of footage to choose from showing that.
Diana has a good point. Footage like this had time and date stamps. A network should be able to date it.
...did SP think that crossing her legs 'could hide' the big belly?
Come on, tht scraf is so flat against her body...
Could the video be The day she announced her pregnancy? Looks like the same scarf and later she dropped the bombshell.
http://www.juneauempire.com/stories/030608/sta_254443377.shtml
The CBC video has been untouched at the top of the page on the following site:
http://askingwhy08.blogspot.com/
Perhaps that is how KO was alerted to it.
No wonder the poor woman's hair was falling out and she was losing weight! Can you imagine running a state and trying to keep up this pack of lies! I know it is a year and a half off, but when Trig turns 3, he will be eligible for services in the school district. Betcha he starts prior to April 18th as they will need to show his birth certificate to enroll him.
if i'm not mistaken, that's a flip calendar on the visitor's side of her desk. don't suppose there's any way to enhance that calendar page for the date?
When I read this message on Ivy Frye's twitter, I was reminded immediately about this "it's a boy" conversation that Sarah had with Piper at the beginning of April 2008, after having spoken to Bristol on the phone. This conversation was included in the footage that Fox bought from the Israeli filmmaker Elan Frank (he filmed Sarah for several days around the 8th April 2008).
I have this video in my files and will upload it again, because I think it disappeared in the meantime from youtube, although I might be wrong.
It's a good idea to "revisit" this clip again.
I personally think that Ivy Frye knows very well what's going on regarding Trig - she seems to be extremely close with Sarah and her family.
There is also another bit of information which I would like to bring to your attention: On April 15, 2008 Ivy Frye asked the IT-Director of the administration how to make her yahoo account the default account on her blackberry:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/32527116@N06/3726476134/sizes/o/
Interesting timing, I would say...!
Those watchdogs with their nasty FOIA requests would have no luck in trying to find out which valuable emails had been exchanged...
I don't know anyone in the office picture, but I'm sure I've seen the woman they interviewed at the convention again. She was a noted crazy, I'll try to find the footage.
Jen: if this photo was taken on April 1, 08, then we have a photo so definitive, the MSM can now start asking questions.
Nana, it is a different scarf.
So I don't think that these were taken the day she announced, although that would be awesome.
I wonder if we can date it (roughly) by her glasses? When did she start wearing the rimless? Because she is wearing the rimless in the pic of her announcing her pregnancy, but not in these pictures/video.
AWESOME find on Mike Tibbles' resignation.
So we can say, with some certainty, that the video is somewhere between 9/11/07 and 5/2/08.
We know she wore that outfit a lot during February and March of 2008.
She announced she was pregnant on 3/6/08. She started wearing scarves REGULARLY about 2 1/2 weeks before she announced she was "pregnant" (on Palin Deception calendar of photos, the scarf first appeared in the stairwell photo on 2/19/08).
The scarves disappeared after Trig was born.
So we can narrow down our confirmation searches to between 2/19/08 and 4/18/08 (Trig's birth) which are 6 months through 8 months pregnant -- any time in which a woman looks far more pregnant than she does here.
Jennifer
And on the subject of dating via her glasses, I went through her official photo archives on the governor's website, and I cannot find a single picture of her after December, 2007 in which she is wearing those glasses.
She seems to have switched almost exclusively to the rimless glasses after that.
That doesn't mean that that picture is necessarily that old, but just some info to digest.
Also to note, she resumed (occasionally) wearing the thin frames AFTER Trig was born.
But, you know, so many photos were scrubbed of the pertinent time period we need that the photos on her website are probably not much use in trying to determine if she wore those glasses during that time.
::sigh::
is this the same timeframe as the Gusty photo?
Jen, the full ADN article you mentioned is as follows:
For more than a week, state lawmakers have been filing into Gov. Sarah Palin's office to explain themselves.
The lawmakers have hometown projects they want to fund -- everything from road improvements to baseball batting cages. And they're hoping Palin won't veto them as she did last year.
The meetings, open to reporters, offer an extraordinary glimpse into the state budgeting process as well as the tenuous relationship between the governor and leading lawmakers.
At stake are about $70 million worth of items lawmakers resurrected from a $231 million list of projects Palin cut last year, saying they didn't qualify for state money in her book.
The vetoes infuriated many lawmakers, who said they felt Palin blindsided them.
Now the Republican governor is displeased that legislators are trying again to fund part of last year's wish list by padding what's known as a supplemental budget.
So she has the veto ax in hand and is ready to strike again.
But first she's offered lawmakers a chance to schedule an appointment to come and argue for their projects. Palin has sat through more than a dozen such meetings so far.
It may seem a little like pupils getting called into the principal's office, but Palin and many lawmakers insist it has been a good exchange.
On Monday, two leading Republican lawmakers representing South Anchorage took their turn -- Rep. Kevin Meyer, co-chairman of the powerful House Finance Committee, and House Majority Leader Ralph Samuels.
The half-hour meeting was cordial, with lots of smiles and laughter, but with a serious undercurrent.
Palin sat at a long boardroom table in her third-floor Capitol office with her chief of staff, Mike Tibbles, budget director Karen Rehfeld and legislative director Russ Kelly.
The guests said $10 million for an expansion of the Anchorage seaport topped their list.
"That's your baby?" Palin asked.
Meyer explained the money was needed soon to allow port director Bill Sheffield, a former Alaska governor, to put it to work right away.
"Anything you would eliminate?" Palin asked.
But Meyer pressed ahead with a list of what he said are valid needs.
"I'll start with the next big one, the Anchorage Museum, $5 million," he said.
The money is needed for maintenance, he said, noting a leaky roof that threatens artwork.
"Who's paying for that Lego thing up front, that statue?" Palin asked.
Meyer went on to talk about road improvement projects, an expansion at the Alaska Native Heritage Center and some needs at schools in his district.
"Here's one that might raise your eyebrows -- Service High AstroTurf," Meyer told Palin.
The Service football field needs $500,000 to install the artificial surface, which can take the pounding of multiple sports teams and which other Anchorage high schools already have, Meyer said.
At Hanshew Middle School, he said, they need a new emergency communications system.
"Yeah, you can't say no to that," Palin said.
The meeting ended on a friendly handshake.
ADN article continued (there is a word limit on comments):
"Thank you, guys," she said.
Palin has until Saturday to use her veto power or the supplemental budget becomes law.
But the $70 million at issue in the supplemental is only a prelude to a much bigger showdown that could be forming between Palin and the Legislature.
Lawmakers are now writing what's known as the capital budget, traditionally the main basket for hundreds of building, maintenance and hometown pet projects across the state.
With the state raking in billions of dollars in surplus oil revenue, the capital budget could grow beyond $2 billion by the time lawmakers adjourn April 13.
On Monday, Palin seemed annoyed that Senate leaders have written their own projects into the capital budget but carved out the ones her administration requested.
"They're not batting cages in Ketchikan, they're things like deferred maintenance on the Glenn Highway," Palin said of her own items.
Asked what was behind the Senate's move, Senate President Lyda Green, a Palin political rival, said, "Well, I guess it would be like a conversation enhancer."
Find Wesley Loy online at adn.com/contact/wloy or call him in Juneau at 1-907-586-1531
Hi Audrey,
Don't know if this helps at all but the url address lists a date of March 2008 on the AK website:
http://www.gov.state.ak.us/newsletter/PAF_March2008.php
I like the part at the beginning when Keith specifically mentions her "B.S." in communications. LOL
One fairly innocuous reason why Keith Olbermann used that footage is that there are a number of shots of $P that have been aired over and over again, and are quite familiar to his regular viewers. One campaign clip in particular, with an Asian-American woman standing at $P's right--our left--waving a sign, I've seen innumerable times.
OTOH, KO is likely to be as exasperated with $P as we are. He and Rachel Maddow are likely to be the first MSM television journalists to air the TriG story in detail. They've devoted tons of air time to Sen. Ensign and Gov. Sanford, as well as to the C Street house in D.C. run by an evangelical group called The Family, at which several GOP legislators live while they're allegedly "batching it." (There's also a larger house owned by the same folks in Arlington, Virginia.) Jeff Sharlet wrote a most incisive book on The Family, and has been a guest on Maddow's show three times lately. The religious beliefs of "The Family" appear very similar to those of $P.
One small point: I don't recall EVER seeing a photo or film clip of $P wearing the big scarves before her "pregnancy" with TriG. Anyone else?
WV: something that in French is very rude!
Audrey, please do practice saying, "Mr. de Mille, I'm ready for my close-up"!
Kerryann - just tried to follow the link and it's not working. Did someone else succeed in looking at it?
Holy mackeral. The ADN article was published April 1st? Has anyone emailed Wesley Loy yet to determine the date of the actual meeting?
WV: intessed - as in, "I'm very intessed in these pictures!"
The important thing to remember about the scarves is that SP admitted that she used her manner of dress to disguise her condition. She provides an explanation, but such an admission and her explanation for it would become excellent material for eventual cross-examination. We can project how that might go:
Q: Gov. Palin, you've admitted that during the early months of 2008 you wore different clothing than usual in order to hide your abdomen, is that right?
PALIN: So that people wouldn't see that I was pregnant.
Q: So you say, but yes or not, you did intentional disguise your midsection, correct?
PALIN: (Any response other than yes or no would result in a repeat of the question until she answered) Yes.
Q: You've stated a reason for that deception, but since you've admitted to intentional deception, can you give us a reason why we should accept your explanation for the deception?
PALIN: Because that's the truth.
Q: OK. So your testimony is that the sole reason for using deception in your choice of clothing that hid your mid-section was so that people wouldn't see that you were pregnant, is that right?
PALIN: Yes, that's what I've said.
Q: Once you announced your pregnancy in early March, by your own statements you would no longer have any reason to use clothing to hide your abdomen so people would not know you were pregnant, correct?
PALIN: Yes, I suppose so.
Q: Let me show you these photos of you after your announcement. As you can see, you continued to wear the same disguise, with scarves and coats, even indoors. Do can we agree that they hide your mid-section, at least in these photos.
PALIN: Somewhat, I agree.
Q: So your mid-section is somewhat disguised. Why did you continue to somewhat disguise your mid-section?
PALIN: Why?
Q: Yes, why? It can't be because you didn't want people to know you were pregnant, as you said, correct?
PALIN: Um.
Q: Could it be you started to disguise your abdomen before your announcement, then continued to disguise it afterwards for the same reason?
PALIN: What reason would that be?
Q: You tell us, Gov. Palin.
PALIN: I just continued to wear the scarves because I liked them.
Q: But after Trig was born, you stopped wearing them, correct?
PALIN: I wore them sometimes.
Q: But not nearly as often, as these photographs indicate. Of course, you didn't have any reason to disguise your mid-section after Trig was born, correct?
(Objection as argumentative sustained.)
Q: OK. So what you've told us is that you had an intentionally deceptive reason to change your clothing style before your pregnancy announcement, and a different reason afterwards, but during both intervals you disguised your mid-section. Can you tell us when exactly the deception started and ended?
(Objection overruled.)
PALIN: I can't say exactly.
Q: Would you agree that the deception started the first time you intentionally changed your clothing to disguise your mid-section?
PALIN: I suppose so.
Q: OK. So when did the deception end?
PALIN: Once I announced I was pregnant, there was no longer a deception.
Q: But the mid-section disguising continued, correct?
PALIN: Not intentionally.
Q: So you say, but that was the result nonetheless, as you've agreed. How do we know that the deception actually ended? Couldn't you just be deceiving us even now?
(Objection overruled.)
PALIN: Because I'm telling the truth.
Q: But you've admitted to intentional deception in that matter. Why should we believe you are telling the truth now?
(Objection as argumentative sustained.)
Q: No further questions.
I hope you all enjoyed this little play. For fun, construct your own mock cross-examinations on all you theories and conjectures and see how they hold up. (Not well, I suspect.) And in case you wonder about it, I do the same for my own theories, including the one regarding Willow, which is why I don't insist that it's right, only that it's possible and a reasonable deduction based on the incomplete evidence.
Dangerous
kerryAnn63: your photo and the one of this meeting we are discussing are also not on the same day -- but your photo and the pg announcement photo that Nana posted earlier might well be on the same day.
Look here.
Look at earrings, scarf inside collar, even the white horizontal lines of her scarf (red circle), hair pouf on back, streaks in hair.
Just for convenience, here is the other comparison. Note on the day of this meeting, earrings are different, as is part of hair, scarf is outside collar, necklace -- but looks like same glasses.
From the story in the NYTimes July 12th, here's where to look for that clock:
"At the governor's Anchorage office, staff members are struggling to roll with Ms. Palin's surprise announcement. Last week, a clock on the wall continued its countdown. Under a "Time to Make a Difference" placard, the clock ticks away the days, hours, minutes and seconds until the scheduled end to Ms. Palin's term. As of Friday, it had 513 days left."
I happen to believe that Sarah did not give birth to Trig. And, there are some pictures that sort of firm up that belief for me. But, I have never seen any of the pics on here and said "AHA! There's no way she was pregnant!"
Now, I have. That video which shows Sarah walking out from behind her desk is absolute PROOF to me that she was not pregnant at that moment.
Of course - we don't really know when that moment was yet, do we?
If it can be accurately dated - it actually IS the nail in the coffin to me.
Still doing some digging around for that durned count-down clock -- it may not be IN her office:
From MSNBC.com, "At the state Capitol in Juneau, the "Time to Make a Difference" clock that counted the time left in Palin's term was taken down from the wall outside her office..."
LATEST GALLUP
Republicans would like to see Mitt Romney run for president again in 2012, a new poll suggests.
The Gallup poll, released on Wednesday, asked Republicans and Republican-leaning independents to chose between six possible candidates for the 2012 Republican nomination.
Romney, who was a front-runner for the 2008 nomination, came out on top with 26 percent of respondents. That gives the former Massachusetts Governor a slight advantage over Sarah Palin, who was chosen by 21 percent of the survey voters.
Former Arkansas Gov. Mike Huckabee and former Minority Leader Newt Gingrich got 19 percent and 14 percent respectively, while much smaller numbers said they would support Governors Tim Pawlenty (Minn.) and Haley Barbour (Miss.)
While the survey results show that Romney is the preferred presidential candidate, Palin is the most popular of the leading GOP candidates.
Seventy-two percent of those surveyed had a favorable opinion of Palin, compared with 56 percent for Romney and 59 percent for Huckabee.
Among all Americans, however, Palin receives the highest negative rating.
Although Romney, Huckabee and Palin each receive a similar favorable rating from the general public, Palin's 45 percent unfavorable rating far outdoes Romney's 29 percent and Huckabee's 23 percent.
kerryann63 said... "Hi Audrey, Don't know if this helps at all but the url address lists a date of March 2008 on the AK website:
http://www.gov.state.ak.us/newsletter/PAF_March2008.php "
The topic just below the Palin-Haagensen picture in question at your URL above, kerryann, is "Alaska-Yukon Sign Accord" with a picture of Yukon Territory Premier Dennis Fenti & Palin which is dated Feb 29, 2008...
So it's getting more and more likely that Jen may have gotten the March 1, 2008 date right.
(ha, ha, I love these WVs -- mine this time is "obest")
To summarize: Here are the three photos of the three events we are comparing:
Left: the meeting that is presented in SP's newsletter dated March 2008, with the photo enlarged off that page.
Middle: Photo in the ADN accompanying its story re SP's March 6 announcement of her pregnancy. (current links to that ADN piece no longer show the photo, but we have screen shots like this one.)
Right: screen shot from Rachel Maddow's recent show that uses video clips from the mystery meeting ( at 3:56 of RM's video is the meeting we are trying to date, which looks like it might have been on April 1 -- per Jen's find).
JEN: can you give us the link of that article you posted, please?
I can't find it on Goog.
Jen--the service flag is only supposed to be displayed if you have a family member that is deployed. So we'd have to change the 9/11/07 date to whatever date his unit deployed. Was she displaying that flag before the deployment? I can't remember seeing her with her service flag lapel pin until his unit left.
(Pulled original and Am reposting this because I erroneously put "Mar 1" as the date Jen might have found.)
Nana: not the same day. Necklace, earrings, and hair are different. Scarf inside collar vs outside collar.
But Jen! If you found the date as being Apr 1 YOU ARE OUR HERO! Sure seems like it from that text you found.
Norwegian blue bears repeating:
"The most important fact for the religious conservatives who love her remains that she gave birth to a baby with downs syndrome rather than opting for an abortion. Everything else pales in comparison. She's viewed as a pro-life politicians who practices what she preaches."
-Steven Waldman in HuffPo
THE most important fact is a lie.
Amy, I posted the article in full here in the comments section. Scroll up!
Track Palin enlisted in September of 2007. He was deployed to Iraq in September of 2008. We have one photograph from (we believe) November of 2007 in which the star is already visible, and she definitely had it in her office by February of 2008. So she had it before he was "deployed."
Amy1 -- Ashley did post the article but I was also able to find a link bypassing the ADN's subscription page: http://www.adn.com/legislature/story/361898.html
Elizabeth -- That is exactly why the flag thing is confusing. BUT we were told she was nominated BEFORE he deployed and we know this footage was shot BEFORE she was nominated. So I am thinking she was hanging the flag against standards. UNLESS.... MAYBE he deployed before she says he depoloyed.... It was always TOO convenient that he enlisted on 9/11of one year and deployed on 9/11 of the next ESPECIALLY when that would be so convenient for a candidate.
Did anyone see pix of her and Track at his deployment ceremony?
Jennifer
Ashley/Jen -- I know the article is posted here, but it would be good to give the link also. To prove to any skeptic that it really is an article on the web and not something I (for example) made up.
Thanks.
Going back to Jen's original find noted in her comment at 8:21 PM yesterday (Jul 15), I located the story at the ADN dated Apr. 1, 2008 (and the Monday referred to is March 31st).
I can also add some more details to what precedes Jen's quote from the story:
"...On Monday, two leading Republican lawmakers representing South Anchorage took their turn -- Rep. Kevin Meyer, co-chairman of the powerful House Finance Committee, and House Majority Leader Ralph Samuels.
The half-hour meeting was cordial, with lots of smiles and laughter, but with a serious undercurrent.
Palin sat at a long boardroom table in her third-floor Capitol office with her chief of staff, Mike Tibbles, budget director Karen Rehfeld and legislative director Russ Kelly.
The guests said $10 million for an expansion of the Anchorage seaport topped their list....
If you look at the video Audrey posted between frames @ 2:10 to 2:20, you can see that there are three women and two men in that segment of the video.
Unless Russ Kelly is a woman, I don't think the ADN article is describing the meeting on the video, therefore...I think more needs to be done to pinpoint the date of the video.
(and BTW, please ignore my conclusion in the final sentence of my previous comment at 1:03 PM earlier today -- it, too, was based on a previous error)
According to the Pentagon fact sheet, the blue service star may be displayed by the family of anyone who is serving during a time of "war." I see nothing about "deployed." According to one photo we have, it appears Palin was already displaying the star while Track was in boot camp. I can see no problem with this based on what I am reading... he was "in service." If others have different info, please post the links.
"The service flag authorized by the Act may be displayed in a window of the place of residence of persons who are members of the immediate family of a person serving in the Armed Forces of the United States during any period of war or hostilities in which the Armed Forces of the United States may be engaged, for the duration of such period of war or hostilities."
http://www.tioh.hqda.pentagon.mil/FAQ/ServiceFlagFactSheet.htm
To summarize what we have - so as not to go too far afield - the people in the room with Palin are:
Mike Tibbles, her chief of staff who resigned May 1, 2008.
Mike Nizich, who was the assistant chief of staff and who replaced Tibbles,
and
(we're pretty sure)
the blond woman in Karen Rehfield, who is Director of the Office of Management and Budget.
We have no ID on the fourth person (second woman.)
This appears to be a fairly routine staff meeting, which makes it difficult to explain why there was a film crew there. However, I have gotten a "lead" that the CBC might have filmed Palin for a human interest segment on her. (Sort of like what Elan Frank did, "followed her" for a few days.) However, I have no date on this, and am still researching it.
As of right now, we have no conclusive date for this video and meeting. The only thing we can say with confidence was that it was taken some time BETWEEN September 2007 (when Track enlisted) and mid April 2008. Palin left Juneau on April 15th to go to Texas and did not return prior to Tibbles' resignation.
But we are working on it, and any leads that our alert readers bring to us are greatly appreciated.
So I started following this blog when I was on pins and needles hoping Obama made it to the white house... the crazy loons hailing the mccain camp gave me the creeps
And I am still here..
And it is still a hot topic.. C4PeePants still gets hot and heavy when a Trig Truther dares bring the subject up
Here's the deal.. One would think, if there is a die hard Palin fan out there.. there would be an outpouring to squash the "Rumor" once and for all..
There is so much passion against it..
But not one person has come up with a Pro Palin blog dedicated to proving Trig is Palin's son.
Why? .. are they not interested.. I don't think so because of how riled and grrrowly they get.. it gets under their skin
Then why oh why won't one of her minions set out to prove he is her son?
Something tells me they have tried..and once they get a little deep into it .. it makes so little sense.. there is no proof! But there seems to be gobs going the other way
mmmhmmmmm...
KaJo, But that article also says, "For more than a week, state lawmakers have been filing into Gov. Sarah Palin's office to explain themselves... The meetings, open to reporters..."
So IF this is one of those meetings, it could have been any combination of attendees. I have been trying to find anything using end of March/beginning of April.
(Amy1 -- You and I may have been posting at the same time so I hope you see the link)
If the service star can be displayed in the person's residence, why would it be in his mother's office?
As Track's mother, Palin is entitled to display the star. I will give her a pass on hanging it in her office instead of her home.
I don't think that the flag should be an issue. Knowing the way that Sarah always uses the troops in one political way or another, I would be confident in suggesting that Sarah displayed a service flag in both her office and her home-- anywhere she was likely to be photographed.
I think we saw some photos of Levi (in that reputable publication, National Enquirer) holding Tripp and photographed at the Palin Wasilla House. The service flag and photo of Track carefully moved so as to always be in shot.
I think Palin custom ordered more than one flag. The Runner's World photos showed the service flag in her window at home.
If this is accurate, the Runner's World flag is actually a bit of faux pas:
"MYTH: A Service Flag should have the name and Service Branch of the enrollee embroidered upon the flag, and the flag may be trimmed with gold fringe.
This myth probably grew out of the desire of families to let the world know the names of their military children, but the regulations do not state anything of the kind. Although the rules do not specifically preclude such a practice, the patterns supplied by the DoD are specific about what should go on a Service Flag, and a name, Service Branch, and fringe are not in the patterns. In fact, the DoD adverts that the flag must be treated with respect, as one would the national flag, and prohibits its use in advertising (except to draw attention to itself, of course) or on objects for sale.6 "It will not be embroidered on such articles as cushions, handkerchiefs, and the like; printed, or designed for temporary use and discarded; or any portion of a costume or athletic uniform. Advertising signs will not be fastened to a staff or halyard from which the service flag is flown.""
http://www.tacticaltechnologies.com/serviceflag.html
I agree. If the video can be dated for sure, these photos clearly show a flat tummy, especially the still showing Palin in front of the white door and the one in front of the credenza. This, for me, would be the "sinking ship" photo.
Another avenue of research would be to chron order the cell phone/blackberries she habitually carries. She's got a thin maroon (looks like) one here. What is it, what does it have on it? Is there any way to i.d. the map; the logo may provide a clue for a particular state office or department. The divisions on the map of the state --the numbered districts, it looks like-- may be pertinent to the topic of discussion under way, that I can't make out under the voiceover. Maybe someone with voice or sound software could separate the voiceover from the discussion. The woman with short brown hair is talking. Any clues in what she is saying to compare to a meeting calendar or schedule of subjects under review?
As to the lip reader... I'd love to have Willow be saying "more bullshit" and Bristol respond "watch it, Wills, there are lip readers and high def microphones out there."
Still fascinated with this hoax after all these months. Good work, everyone.
I just sent a "contact us" note to the CBC, asking them when that file footage in Juneau was shot.
I included their cbc link, the date of the piece 9/2/08, and the time we were asking about.. 2:10.
I figured, what the heck... all they can say is no! eh? :)
punkinbugg --there's one more option: they can fail to respond, which has been my experience with the 15 or so places I have sent my plea to, for attention to this matter: to Sally Quinn, Maureen Dowd, the NYer mag, the NYTimes, the WashPost, among too many others to recall.
I could be wrong, but it appears there's a cut before we see Willow talking. No guarantee she's responding to Sarah saying "our baby Trig."
All of you, and especially, Audrey keep up the good work, because this phony is showing no signs of quitting. I've got 4 things:
1. Someone linked a Huffington Post article about SP's most notorious video gaffes -- but they didn't include the witch exorcism video. I never understood how being party to the belief in witches alone wouldn't sink her!!?
2. I agree with Audrey that the CBC piece was our only initial hope that the MSM would expose her -- I certainly saved it from youtube. My trigger to overcome my initial absurdity response was actually an US magazine article dated Sept 15, 2008. The only MSM reference I ever saw about her lies.
3. I realized in October of last year that the reason I have been vigorously pursuing (yes, even obsessed) with her ultimate exposure is because I diagnosed her with Narcissistic Personality Disorder. I am a physician and my mother had the same disorder. Well, while the Vanity Fair article was mostly milquetoast, they did mention her NPD. Further, Maureen Dowd pointed the NPD aspect out in the NYT's Op-Ed on July 5.
3. I have become convinced there is a plot by the MSM to suppress the obvious. I doubt there is anyone here who can't see thru this fraud. There are certainly people in the MSM who visit here and have basic reasoning capabilities. But why? why will none of them step forward and expose this hoax? I can only think of one thing, they WANT to keep her alive. It is liking shooting fish in a barrel; she is attractive and a fascinating character. Why pull her down when she guarantees ratings?
4. In the same vein, the Wash Post publishes her little wonk piece 2 days ago as a position essay against the Cap and Trade Bill! While I doubt she wrote it, that is not my point, the MSM and her advisers continue to shove her down our throats. However, Rachel Maddow last night pointed out that on numerous occasions during the campaign last year she supported cap and trade, including the VP debate and on the McCain-Spalin website (subsequently scrubbed). More lies, phoniness, and handling. I don't care if she changed her mind on the issue and presented reason, but that was NOT addressed.
We can do this -- something, or someone -- serendipity -- will make her moose crap encrusted foot go into her mouth.
It is analagous to what Semmelweiss -- the father of handwashing hygeine, had to suffer 150 yrs ago. He knew he was right, i.e. handwashing between deliveries eliminates puerperal sepsis in post-partum women. The status quo derided him and only after his tormemted death was he vindicated.
Stay strong, argue based on the facts and Spalin's vacuous rebuttals, dismissals, and deceits.
From the beginning, I have stated I will bet my Medical License, and my putting stroke that Trig is not Spalins,
Joe Christmas
I recently found your blog and website, having been curious about Gov. Palin's resignation and reading some things online.
I had of course heard the rumors last year that SP was not Trig's mother but I never really paid much attention and I admit I thought it was probably just a notion of some crazy conspiracy theorists.
But now I finally saw your website and looked at all those photos and - - -
Wow. There is no way she was pregnant esp. considering the other photo from one of her first pregnancies where she was huge. and no way her belly changed so much in size so fast to that famous picture then somehow shrank again to where it was not noticeable to flight attendants.
I am stunned!
Thank you for all your work to document this. More and more I feel like we really dodged a bullet by not having this insane woman a heartbeat from the presidency.
btw it should probably not be difficult to track down a date on that footage from CBC. they might even have an online archive where you could look it up. Otherwise find out contact info for their footage licensing and talk to an archivist.
as if we need more reasons for exposing SP. here's an article on the POWER behind her lust for power:
http://www.talk2action.org/story/2009/7/16/143533/029/
Hoodie,
Don't you know that none of the Palin children seem to go to school? Showing Trig's birth certificate to enroll in services is the least of their problems---how that child got any of the vital early intervention for his Down's syndrome while being dragged around as a campaign prop is beyond me.
Carolyn @ 9:12 I don't think Amy's three photos are from the same day. The first two appear to be but the third, the Rachel Maddow screen shot, the earrings are different.
pumpkinbugg
way to just cut through the BS. Sometimes just asking is all that it takes. Hope that it works. (but considering that it's about Palin, I'd still verify it independently---we of all people know how "facts" are blurred concerning her and how often the media has mixed them up even without her help.)
I admit to breathless anticipation for the dating of that video. I live in NYC, hubby is in the media, we know everyone (times editor, AP editor, LA times features editor, you name one) and I would personally send this story to people we know if this video is April 1 or another close date to the "birth." In fact, if this video can be dated by Monday, I am having a party for many major media people and would set it up on the computer to show people.
I am not name dropping, I just want to help end her political career. I don't care about anything else about her or her life is she is no longer a threat to me!!
sandra said...
If the service star can be displayed in the person's residence, why would it be in his mother's office?
Because this is $P we're talking about. She gets maximum mileage by having Track in uniform, out of the country, presumably out of trouble, and only a flag to decorate her office. Living-room windows, facing the street, are where I remember seeing faded blue- and gold-star banners hanging when I was a girl.
Many of the people who work at my husband's firm festoon their walls with diplomas and awards. Not my husband. He totally plays down that sort of thing. His swag is all at home, and his office is filled with stacks of papers.
I know someone who knows a producer at CBC. They are getting in touch with the producer today to get info on that footage. I can't guarantee it will turn up anything, but lets hope it does!
Oops - I meant Bristol, not Willow, in my earlier post.
Get ready for the REAL Sarah Palin - unconstrained by political correctness...today she tweets:
AKGovSarahPalin Planning inauguration w/LtGov in 10 days, Frbanks. W/same cabinet, same positive pro-AK agenda it's all good, consistent success bc everyone
AKGovSarahPalin elected is replaceable;Ak WILL progress! + side benefit=10 dys til less politically correct twitters fly frm my fingertps outside State site
WV: poetsi - Tweets from the Twit!
carolyn -- sorry if I was not that clear. I'm afraid my conclusion from these photos is that the left and middle ones were on the same day, but the photo on the right was NOT on that day: many differences. Including one I did not mention before: of course she must have had had multiples of these black jackets -- the one on the right seems to have a longer length of material extending from the bottom of the collar out to the front (the flat part where the front buttons are). Just a slightly different cut -- and admittedly hard to tell.
The photo on the right is the mystery meeting that Audrey also has full body screen shots from (the slim profile shots of SP).
So yes, it is important to date this meeting, to rule it in or out of our period of interest -- the time when she would be showing her pregnancy.
Also, re the extra woman in the photo: it has been my experience in the corporate world that if a woman is a secretary, she is almost like a non-person -- so one could well ignore her in identifying the participants or counting bodies in the meeting. Or, the newspaper article could be describing a meeting in which an aide came and went, but the aide would not be mentioned by name or in any other way.
Who shot the video ?
I'd put money on KTUU, the Anchorage NBC affiliate.
Thank you Joe Christmas and Ariane.
Just when I feel like getting out the TINFOIL, I read posts like yours and realize I'm not THAT crazy!
Joe C., I had a similar thought to your topic # 3: They WANT her out there. "They" in my case is the RNC. She is out there as the proverbial shiny object, lulling Democrats and Independents into a sense of complacency of a slam-dunk win in 2012, while the Republicans say, "Oooh isn't she pretty? And she says things we LIKE!"
She is the lightning rod for frustrated people, left and right.
I think the Republican bosses are going to USE HER to rake in as much flag-wrapped, gun-totin', baby-kissin' money as possible,,, THEN let the cat out of the bag and toss her overboard.
...and then, at the perfect time, SOMEBODY will step into the vacuum as the RNC candidate... somebody who can put together a sentence without winking.
That's why this stuff needs to come out now.
"Jen--the service flag is only supposed to be displayed if you have a family member that is deployed."
But Sarah doesn't think the rules apply to her, remember? She can do what she likes, until a court tells her she can't.
"If the service star can be displayed in the person's residence, why would it be in his mother's office?"
This is Sarah Palin, remember? More people will see it in her office. What good is it having your kid avoid arrest by enlisting if you don't get to show off?
It is interesting that the star flag is supposed to be displayed in the “residence” of an immediate family member yet Palin had one in her office.
BG, the hair is also different if you look at the way it's pulled up on the side.
But all the rest is the same and that huge jacket, wasn't that often a fake pg hideaway?
Hey JoeChristmas, I like your posts. And the Semmelweiss epiphany is like my own re hand-washing. All my life I heard how important it was, all my life I paid no attention. UNTIL I was in the NICU with my fragile newborn twins for a week, and I saw how scrupulously the nurses washed their hands ALL the time. (I learned SO MUCH from those good nurses!) So it's my new religion. A lot better religion than SP's, no?
Since you are an expert on NPD, can you tell us what is thought to cause it? As an entirely hypothetical question, I wonder if childhood abuse, of the sort Dr. CBJ deals in, could have any relationship to incidence of NPD? Just as a hypothetical?
Still trying to figure out who the third woman in the footage is. I am starting to wonder if she is second in command to Karen Rehfeld, since SP's Chief of Staff and Deputy CofS are there. I have been trying to find a photo of JoEllen Hanrahan who is a management analyst and is quoted all over the web in regards to Alaska's budget. No luck finding a photo, though...
Here's a link to the budget office's list of employees:
http://www.state.ak.us/cgi-bin/whitepage.cgi
Jennifer
Now I am feeling like a crazy stalker... I am leaning heavily toward the third woman in the footage being JoEllen Hanrahan of the budget office.
JEH of Juneau announced her daughter's engagement: http://www.juneauempire.com/stories/062504/nei_hanrahanyandow.shtml
JEH has a Facebook page but doesn't have a pix of herself. HOWEVER, her daughter (by the name in the announcecment) is one of her FB friends. Looking at the daughter's pix and the footage of JEH, I see a pretty strong resemblance:
http://www.facebook.com/people/T-Hanrahan-Yandow/590318409
Jennifer
IS THIS A THREAT?
'Less politically correct' Tweets soon, Palin threatens
The Associated Press "reports" that "Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin plans to stay in touch using Twitter even after leaving office on July 26" and "The governor also promises to post "less politically correct" messages."
Palin's tweet said, "elected is replaceable; Ak WILL progress! + side benefits 10 dys til less politically correct twitters fly frm my fingertps outside State site."
At her Twitter spot, Palin promises "I'll stay in touch w/whomever wants via personal twtr site;launch July 26;in meantime it's pleasure to update interested folks on State biz!"
This entry was posted on Friday, July 17th, 2009 at 1:11 pm and is filed under Uncategorized.
ALRIGHT!
We actually might get helped by a subpoena that has been issued by someone in Tennessee:
Read Gryphen's blog, specifiaclly the topic
"More trouble headed Palin's way before she can make her hasty getaway."
Seems they want quite a few infos there - INCLUDING DATES OF BIRTH!!!
So look over at IM -- a storm is brewing that would require Trig's birthdate to be identified for UNDER OATH purposes. Oh, my.
Audrey/Morgan:
I about busted a gut last night because KTUU, channel 2, in Anchorage, has a new ad for a segment they will be airing on 7/20 called "Sarah Palin's Wild Ride"!
It's basically a look into the Governor's life for the last few years...I couldn't help but be amused at the title of the segment, not that it has anything to do with the actual "wild ride" but hmmm, ya think that someone heard it somewhere else?
I leave this URL everywhere I can:
http://tinyurl.com/shocked-doc
It nailed it for me, and leaves some $arah-lovers with a clammy feeling.
Dangerous ~ that was AWESOME! Your most excellent point was made about WHY diguise it AFTER the announcment.
Joe Christmas ~ Do you see any signs in $arah of Borderline Personality Disorder (BPD)? I was married to a BPD for 22 years (he shredded 7 people's lives). The way the gov acts in public so very much reminds me of my ex-husband.
One thing I learned from the support groups who helped me was that a woman BPD can be far more deadly than a man BPD. The reason is because a female BPD will pick up a weapon when her reality goes awry, whereas a male BPD will just use his hands to choke you.
Tina
All you folks are something else. And to not throw in the towel despite $P now following the money (poll should list MONEY as motive since Sarah got used to elitist footwear during campaign and has to leave public employment so she can get outta waders and carhartts) and keeping the clues and comments coming for almost a year now! Good on everyone.
I hope CBC follows thru and investigates to pick up the slack from American MSM. I am sure there are plenty Canadians that are glad Palin won't be rearing her ugly comments over the border air waves anymore. They don't have to sweat that one anymore.
What a cooperative effort and family birthing experience-bringing the Trig Truth to life. Thank you on behalf of duped Alaskans and Americans. The power of the first Amendment is here to stay.
Keith, Rachel, or the Republican media ladies that in past have been outspoken on Palin's lack of brain power-Someone is gonna jump on this fish rot from Wasilla/Dillingham now that it has morphed into all the fecunity of garden compost and some good will come out of it.
Sarah won't have a leg of integrity to tetter on-too bad she dragged so many family members and naive others who chose to view her with ruby spiked lenses.
Still hope she will get Tanked by the Wasilla Wonder:Levi- who despite letting someone get too close to his calvins...he will enlighten us all with some insider revelations- especially how cynically the national campaign covered and helped create this hoax. I'd buy that book even tho I rarely buy People, Enquirer etc. We aren't done with Palin till the not-pregnant lady sings:I punked ya all.
I looked through a ton of photos but didn't se that same scarf again. The hair, glasses and jacket seem to match the feb 11 photo on the blog photo calendar. Maybe she got out the scarf when the camera crew showed up then later decided it wasn't enough camo and didn't wear it again. I'll keep looking
Ive reconsidered and dont think that the photos could match the Feb 11. The jacket seems much more fitted at the shoulders on the undated pics than the in Feb.
OMG - is this it?
http://www.aksenate.org/french/032908_legislative_update.htm
The discussion about emails reminded me of something else to happen around the end of July that might have triggered the resignation screech. That is about the time of the latest deadline for releasing emails under the FOIA requests made by several entities, including MSNBC last fall after Sarah was nominated. While it is expected that the administration will ask for another extension it seems possible that they may be ready to release some of the information. And didn’t the courts rule that private email accounts with governmental information had to be released as well? Maybe someone told Sarah what information was about to be released.
NILAP, i DO believe you're right! that's a NAIL with a DATE on it:
MARCH 28, 2008! yikes!
wv: WORSIDU, slang for 'a worse scandal' is upon you, sarah!
elenaR posted this at TT, thought i'd pass it on:
Lindsay Lohan stars in (reportedly abysmal) TV movie.
"Pregnancy hurts when it's a lie!"
"All her career needed was a little bump."
http://abcfamily.go.com/abcfamily/path/section_Movies+Labor-Pains/page_Detail
Or google "lindsay lohan labor pains"
WOW! This is the article about the young man who got into Palin’s personal Yahoo email account:
http://www.knoxnews.com/news/2009/jul/17/long-list-of-palin-records-sought/
“Shirley gave Davies a July 27 deadline to narrow his subpoena request or present proof of the records' relevance and admissibility.”
Did you notice JULY 27? Palin is resigning effective JULY 26, the day BEFORE the hearing in Tennessee. When was the date that the request for subpoena was filed – usually about 1 or 2 weeks before the hearing. Seems like it would be the week of July 1, and Palin hastily announced her resignation on July 3 in a shaken, hyperventilating voice that EVERYONE noticed.
What is the significance of resigning on 7-26-09? It is not the last day of the month, it is probably not the last day of a pay period. It is an odd day. But when I just read this article about the subpoena request being delayed until 7-27-09, IT JUMPED OUT AT ME WHY SHE PICKED THE ODD DATE OF 7-26-09 TO RESIGN.
nilap said...
***OMG - is this it?
http://www.aksenate.org/french/032908_legislative_update.htm***
This meeting was on 3/28, per the site. I think the participants look the same as in the 'who are these folks?' photo. But she really did a craptastic job of padding, if this is indeed 3 weeks after her announcement. And once again, no way in hell did that woman give birth to a 6+ pound baby 3 weeks after this meeting.
I really wish I had a contact at MSNBC! I walk past their studios a couple of times a week with my eyes peeled for K and R.
Damn, although the participants are the same at this 3/28 meeting, the clothing of everyone but fashion plate SP is different from the other pictures. Sigh.
@C4P ethics filer mcleod "jumped" gov palin @ gop convent last yr-- a wk b4 trig was born! i distracted mcleod so gov could get to her suv.
4:39 PM Jul 14th from web
hey everyone. look at this tweet from ivy frye, palin's assistant. wasn't it reported that this "confrontation" occurred 6 weeks before trig was born? omg, did she misspeak in anger? does this give us an admission of the actual date of trig's birth?
Nilap: "I've reconsidered and dont think that the photos could match the Feb 11. The jacket seems much more fitted at the shoulders on the undated pics than the in Feb."
I agree that it's a different jacket, but otherwise you're dead on about the rest of her appearance, esp the hair, which has a large part, sort of unusual for her. You can even see a hint of the white necklace. My thought is she took off the scarf and closer fitting jacket and replaced it with the bulkier jacket...which she of course kept on during the event. Or she started with the big jacket and switched to the other. (Feb 11 pic can be seen on PD website, click SP Pregnancy Photos, then Feb 2008)
If it's a Feb 11 picture, we have further outstanding and undeniable evidence of a completely flat belly in an early-third trimester "pregnancy."
Hi nilap -- Take a look at all four pix for comparison:
http://i30.tinypic.com/f2klld.jpg
It might well be the same scarf, but scarf is inside her jacket collar at Hollis meeting, outside at the mystery meeting. Necklace not visible at the Hollis meeting. Of course she could have just re-tied the scarf.
The office looks different to me -- they could have moved for this meeting to a larger room.
FWIW, the service flag appears in a Feb. 12, 2008, pic of SP (see PD website) in her office. So she definitely wasn't waiting for Track's deployment to put it up.
nilap, That is not from the same day because Mike Tibbles' tie is different and if that's Karen Rehfeld, her suit is different. BUT it does support the newspaper article that says a series of meetings were held for about a week and that meeting falls in that week. I started looking at newsletters the other day then got distracted. We need to look at all legislators' newsletters for end of March/beginning of April...
I can't tell if it's the same scarf, but it is a black suit and all she wore were black suits and colorful scarfs. (Didn't anyone ever notice she started wearing black EVERY DARN DAY!?!)
Jen
Hi nilap, your link didn't work for me, but I found it on Hollis French's web page. This is the tinyURL of your link:
http://tinyurl.com/mftos3
To me it looks like she is wearing a different jacket in French's 032908 legislative update. Her jacket has a button-down collar and the scarf is around her neck, not under the collar like it is in the screenshots from the CBC video.
With so many people searching so many different sources, I do think it's only a matter of time before someone finds that one bit of information that will finally take her down.
Also, too, when Ms Palin is no longer governor, perhaps people in Alaska will no longer be afraid to speak out. Sean Parnell couldn't be as small minded and vindictive as Sarah, could he?
Punkinbugg (yesterday @ 8:37 AM), if $arah Palin raises money, it would be NOT be for the Republican Party/RNC. It'll be for whomever she feels has the "right message", believes in the "right things" and whomever matches her beliefs hand-in-glove.
Who else is crazy enough to split from the Republican Party and support her and vice versa? Perry? Jindal? Barbour?
-----------------
Wayofpeace (yesterday @ 1:53 PM), sure, it's a threat -- and a promise -- and a coded message. Those of us who are watching Palin because we think she's every sort of crazy/dangerous/sociopathic/deluded, and her followers too, are now getting to the point where we know these aren't just random maunderings like "I baked a cake today".
-----------------
nilap (@ 7:12 AM today), I looked at the picture at Hollis French's www.aksenate.org site -- I see two things that cause me to think you're close, but no cigar (sorry!).
One: Palin seeems to either be wearing a thick white necklace or a type of white t-shirt in the screen captures that may be taken off the CBC video, and in your find at the www.aksenate.org site the white object cannot be seen (but that may be because the scarf is bunched together at her neck).
But the other thing nixes the picture altogether: Karen Rehfeld is wearing a different outfit in that picture.
I.e., it has to be a different day. But I'll bet it's close...Palin may have worn that scarf 2 days in a row...
For nilap:
One more thing to add to the Hollis French www.aksenate.org pictures you found -- the meeting seems to be in a conference room, not in Palin's office.
But did you see the picture at the bottom of the French page? Palin posing with -- apparently -- Rep. Holmes, Rep. Doogan, and Sen. French? Palin seems to be wearing a seemingly well-fitting long jacket and either a pencil skirt or a slim black dress with those black pantihose...
For comparison purposes, I'm going to do a cut-and-paste of Palin's pose and match it up with that picture from April 13, 2008 where she's standing the exact same way only with a huge belly in front of her. Should be interesting. I'll post where I put it up for review when I get it done.
nilap -- the clothes are the same, the hairdo is the same, can't tell if she has the necklace on though, and people involved seem to be a different meeting, perhaps on the same day? Same scarf but worn around neck in one, and around collar in the other. In any event, these photos from the meeting with Hollis French on March 28, 2008, do not appear to be that of a woman who will give birth to a normal sized baby within two weeks.
http://www.aksenate.org/french/032908_legislative_update.htm
Good find, nilap. Same scarf, but in Audrey's pic it is under the jacket collar, exposing Palin's necklace. In French's pic the scarf seems to be inside the jacket, so no necklace shows. She could have moved the scarf around between photos, but more likely the pics are different days in the same general time frame -- circa March 28 -- when she was wearing the same "maternity" clothes.
Perhaps of interest:
Lindsey Lohan in "Labor Pains" on ABC Family channel tomorrow (Sun.) at 8 edt. A secretary fakes pregnancy to keep from being fired.
(Fiction, but maybe a few more people will realize Fake Pregnancy Happens.)
Good find nilap! While the Hollis French newsletter pictures are not in the same room as the CBC footage, it's clearly the same outfit, scarf & the same glasses (the exact same glasses that she's wearing in the 3/29 photos from the spouses'luncheon ) in both sets of images. Furthermore, the other people who are in both, namely, the woman in red, are also dressed the same. According to the text in the newsletter, then, both sets of images should be from the 28th of March, 2008. The newsletter, dated March 29, 2008, starts out saying "yesterday ..."
nilap--
No, it doesn't look like 3/29/08 to me--I checked out the link you had. The blonde lady has a different outfit on (I think it's the same blonde lady), GINO is wearing her scarf a little differently--around her neck on 3/29, and under the collar on the date in question, and also it looks like a larger table grouping on 3/29. However, someone posted that GINO met with legislators all week, in an article from April 1st, so this could all be from that same week. (Oh please, oh pretty please!)
In addition, it is my understanding that the legislative session is absurdley (IMHO) short, lasting like from Jan to April only? So, I think that alone should really narrow down the time frame.
In my opinion, I'd say it looks very promising that this date in question is from late March of 2008, and that GINO lacks the bump that SHOULD HAVE BEEN THERE if the April 13th photo is showing an ACTUAL PREGNANT PERSON. !!!
Sorry for the capitalizations but I'm in a exclamatory mood!! There is no way that if that video is from March 29th that GINO suddenly busted out a bump on April 13th, unless the April 13th bump is a fake!
Okay--I'm spending too much time thinking about this & comparing back & forth--the Hollis French picture shows same glasses, same scarf/outfit as the footage from the CBC, however, in the Hollis French pictures, her scarf is inside her jacket--a shot of this same event can also be found in Rep. Holmes' photo gallery where it has a date of 6/21/08. This date, however, would be consistent with the date it was uploaded. It is clearly something that happened during the working session of the legislature & I think the Hollis French newsletter gives us a pretty secure date for that picture. The CBC footage is probably from a different day, especially if the blonde woman seated to SP's left (in the Hollis French picture) is the same as the blonde woman seated across the table from her in the CBC footage.
I didn't look carefully enough in comparing the two sets of images & if the blonde woman is the same person, she's wearing two completely different outfits, which would strongly suggest two different days.
On the plus side, however, SP looks no more "pregnant" in the more securely dated March 28, 2008 pictures in this outfit than she does in the CBC footage yet to be securely dated.
Thanks to all for keeping up with all of this!
I've been staring at the three pictures for the last few days, and a comment made here earlier just clicked. Can you positively date those pictures between January and April 2008? Look at Sarah's bleached hair. I thought that pregnant women today do not risk exposure to harsh hair chemicals. OK, it hasn't been touched up for the last few weeks, but IMHO that's too much streaking too close to her due date. Anyone with more knowledge in this field-- please weigh in!
nilap's Hollis French pictures appear to show a consistent amount of streaking. Fuzzy pictures, hard to tell.
I just scrolled down to see my WV, which is tynti. I read it as tint, maybe it's a good sign.
On the other hand, if it's tnt, that's pretty explosive.
Amy1 and Hammer and Feather,
I think Spalin is the text book example of NPD. The hallmark features are delusions of grandeur and an inability to accept criticism. When I saw that phony get gussied up and come out of airplanes like a queen, that was grandiosity. We all know she can't take a joke or respond with any civility to criticism.
BPD people tend to exhibit more manipulative behaviour, acting out, and are very destructive in relationships. There may be crossover, but they are both difficult to treat.
As far as there root causes, BPD tends to originate from sexual abuse, whereas NPD is a little more unclear. In my mother's case, her mother had died when she was 3 yo and she was coddled by her aunts and spoiled by my father. She never lifted a finger in her life, but she was smart and could talk a good game. Whose to say with Spalin? Her father gives me the creeps and she's from Alaska, and an ex-Catholic, etc. There could have been some sort of childhood trauma or abuse, but she such a liar and phony I doubt we'll ever know.
(As my wife pointed out from a rally in PA in Sept. of '08) Everybody clap their hands... Hockey moms, hockey moms, are their any hockey moms?, hockey moms.
Our goal needs to be making sure that the 20% of the population that are blind fools does not become any larger.To paraphrase Audrey, we have to keep her as far away from the beltway as possible.
Joe Christmas
Nilap: OMG - is this it?
http://www.aksenate.org/french/032908_legislative_update.htm
--------
No, doesn't look like the same meeting, but poor Trig is sure getting squished at this one. How easy it is to forget not to lean in tight against a table when you have no real reason not to.
Amy1 @ July 17, 2009 11:31 AM mentioned possible origins for personality disorders such as Narcissism, Borderline, Anti-Social and Histrionic. I learned at a class on "High Conflict Personalities" with Bill Eddy, LCSW, Esq., that biological factors, early childhood factors, social learning and aspects of the larger culture can contribute to personality disorders.
Attachment disorders of infants/very young children is a reason for some problems.
I read in one of the books on Palin that her father decided to move from Idaho to Alaska around the time Sarah was born (February). Her mother packed up the family belongings while tending her newborn. As soon as school ended (Chuck was a teacher), the family packed up the car and moved. The family included 3 children under the age of 3!!! Sarah was only a few months old when they moved.
Imagine moving to the woods in the early 1960's with 3 children under 3 years old. With all the work of setting up a house, hunting and fishing for food, cooking from scratch, watching 2 preschoolers AND a newborn, there likely wasn't alot of time left for Sarah. Soon a fourth child was added to the family.
I imagine that this dynamic had some impact on the children.
Another thing I learned was that people can have maladaptive personality traits that don't meet the threshold for a personality disorder. A person can have traits from any or several of the disorders combined with a disorder (or without a full blown PD). Saying SP has NPD is probably oversimplifying things. She likely has traits from all of the Cluster B group listed above.
Anyway, I, too, have wondered what background or dynamics can lead to personality disorders. It's an interesting topic. Since we're not generally taught about PDs, it's hard for alot of us to realize what's going on when we come across someone with a PD.
nilap, close but no cigar.
Scarf isn't right (maybe same scarf, but not placed the same)...some of the same people though, I think.
Darn.
also, something to note in the pics nilap posted...
...you can see very clearly that the service star for Track is NOT in her window.
I take that back; it's a different window they are posing in front of.
As you look at the pictures to compare, be sure to check the earrings. SP has on a different pair of earrings in the announcement picture and the screen shot of meeting.
There was a governor's meeting in DC Feb. 23-25, 2008. http://tinyurl.com/myzwpn
Pictures shown already have the same scarf. Notice the yellow in the scarf as you compare picture too.
nilap said...
OMG - is this it?
http://www.aksenate.org/french/032908_legislative_update.htm
~~~~~~~
Palin looks the same, but the women are different. The blond man appears to have a different tie, but could be the same man.
I thought for a minute it was the same. It could still be with different players coming into the meeting.
Thanks for all the comments regarding the French photo. I sure was excited for a while. I had to catch a plane right after my posting and now agree it's not the same day but it has to be ohh so close. For reference I used the firefox plug in Cooliris that was mentioned on this site a while back and search google photos for "Alaska governor office".
I just looked at ennealogic's video on the TT site and saw her great review of the Elan Frank pix again, and esp the one with SP in a black jacket and scarf very much like the ones we are looking at here.
So I added again to our set of comparables: the photo on the right now is the one taken 10 days before the stated birthday of Trig.
In other words, from left to right):
Photo 1: From SP's newsletter dated "March 2008"
Photo 2: photo accompanying her preg announcement in the ADN on Mar 6
Photo 3: our mystery meeting
Photo 4: Mar 28 Hollis meeting
Phtot 5: Elan Frank video, Apr 8.
nilaP 7/18/09 @ 7:12 am, Good find of another picture of Sarah in her “late stage of pregnancy” but it is not the same conference room and people are wearing different ties, jackets, etc. Tibbles is wearing a green tie in the CBC video and a red tie in the Hollis French picture. Also, Karen Rehfield is wearing a black suit and white blouse in the CBC video and a red suit in the Hollis French picture.
HOWEVER, from the site nilaP posted:
http://www.aksenate.org/french/032908_legislative_update.htm
this is Hollis French’s letter dated 3-29-08, I looked at Sarah’s calendars. French said “yesterday”, but I believe he actually wrote this on 3-28-08 and “yesterday” would have been Thursday, 3-27-08
At 4:30 on Palin’s Thursday 3-27-08 calendar (she is in Juneau), it says:
GOV: COS, Kelly; Rehfield, Senator French, Rep. Doogan; Rep. Holmes re: Supplemental Budget (JNU – Large Conf. Rm.)
COS then would be Mike Tibbles, Kelly would be Russ Kelly, the Legislative Director until replaced by Kelly Goode May 1, 2008:
http://gov.state.ak.us/archive.php?id=1127&type=1
Also, Palin had an interview with Channel 2 in her Juneau office at 3:25-3:35. Anyone know if there is any video out there, I believe that would be KTUU?
Sarah is wearing the same outfit, scarf, hair style, glasses and earrings. The only difference seems to be that the scarf is worn outside the collar in the CBC video, and worn inside the collar for the picture with French, Holmes and Doogan.
(Do all photographers in Alaska use wax paper over the lens? It is amazing the number of photos of Palin that are fuzzy – and frustrating!
But we did learn from the French pictures that they were taken in the LARGE conference room in Juneau.
Here is a picture of the conference table in her office in Juneau taken 4-1-08
http://www.housemajority.org/gallery/v/wilson/Cliff_+Peggy_+and+Palin.JPG.html
and the article about the bill signing:
http://www.allamericanpatriots.com/48745178_alaska-governor-palin-signs-bill-fort-rousseau-cau
and Palin’s 4-1-08 calendar says:
12:30-12:45 GOV. Bill Signing HB176 – Ft. Rousseau Causeway Park – Rep. Wilson (JNU – Governor’s Office)
So we know the CBC video was taken in her Juneau office. Does anyone know when Sarah put up that flag of Israel in her Juneau office? It appears in the Juneau Hike video at 8:54, it is the little flag on the left side of the window:
http://www.alaskahdtv.com/2008/hike-with-sarah-palin/
In the CBC video, the Israeli flag is not there.
We have Sarah’s calendars for February 14-17, March 1-31 and April 1-18. I have looked through all the dates to find a meeting in her Juneau office with Tibbles, Nizich and Rehfield and the unidentified woman. I cannot find any such meeting. It is possible this meeting took place between Feb 18-Feb 29, but we do not have the calendar pages to confirm. Would Andree McLeod have the calendars for those dates?
"it has to be a different day. But I'll bet it's close...Palin may have worn that scarf 2 days in a row..."
If a scarf is not something one usually wears... maybe you have one or two, and if you're thinking "how do I pretend to have a belly on me" and you try it... then you go out and buy a couple more scarves, right? You don't want to sink a lot of money into fake maternity clothes and disguises, especially when you feel this is going to be easy to pull off because nobody would suspect it because you're smarter than anyone else... I bet Sarah didn't buy more than two or three scarves at the most, and had one favorite that she used a lot.
(Now somebody is going to point out a bunch of pictures with a dozen different scarves in them- but I think it makes sense, why spend a lot of money on scarves? She didn't buy a lot of fake maternity clothes, she didn't plan on looking pregnant long. And she has this tendency to assume that if she says something, everyone's going to accept it. I've always felt that she's a bit surprised when people challenge what she says. Angry, yes, but she really thinks people should just believe her. She thinks she's smarter than other people. She never expected pictures of her to be examined closely. I wonder how she got
"Sean Parnell couldn't be as small minded and vindictive as Sarah, could he?"
Few are. And I don't see why he should make himself look bad for her. She may feel she requires gratitude, but is she in a position to demand anything, once she's no longer governor? I know none of us want her on the national stage, but it doesn't seem like the republicans are stupid enough to promote her. They'll use her, and try to calm her when she's angry, but I'd bet money they're not going to really support a bid for future office. Stick a fork in her: she's done.
OK, scarf down (trying to stay on topic) this: Palin's poetry in this post and one it refers to.
www.huffingtonpost.com/
john-lundberg/
sarah-palin-the-anti-poet
_b_237935.html
Sarah said she picked July 26 for the transition to Parnell because it is the annual Governor's Picnic, an event already planned and already to be attended by Parnell and other politicians.
Maybe the TN email sleuth, or FOIA requests, or Sherry's sentencing tomorrow has something to do with the general timing, but the picnic is the reason for July 26.
Ivyfree said...
"If the service star can be displayed in the person's residence, why would it be in his mother's office?"
"This is Sarah Palin, remember? More people will see it in her office. What good is it having your kid avoid arrest by enlisting if you don't get to show off?"
Heh. Indeedy.
You guys are doing a GREAT JOB with those photos. No way I could have dressed or sat or walked like that after my FIRST trimester.
And thanks, Joe Christmas, for your very insightful comments on NPD and BPD. I borrowed a book on these psychiatric disorders from a scholar I know (speciality: traumatic brain injury, works for the Army). All kinds of lines just jump out at me...
mlewis:
Don't get caught up in whether she took a chance dying her hair or not. The chemicals are not as harsh as they used to be and even so, it is a personal choice the same way that having a cup of caffinated coffee does not mean you are condemning your unborn to be deformed. So many people become the pregnancy police. This is not meant to be snarky or shoot you down but if you watch a clip of the 70's classic "the way we were" A very pregnant Barbara Steisand character is drinking a martini and smoking a cigarette---let's get a banned film bonfire going, shall we? Maybe we should take food out of the hands of obese people too. Personal risks vs.personal choices gives us the human dignity to live our own life. (by the way, I was neurotically safe pregnant woman but now days "being safe" can get little carried away. For example, I did not sit in the back of a car rather than the passenger seat--"just in case"--My conclusion was: relaxed happy pregnant woman = great pregnancy and fortunately for me, very healthy happy twins. I put the odds in my favor by being careful but the outcome was still out of my hands. Anything could have happened---even a teenager giving birth to a Down's baby)
Also let's compare the risks-- highlighting your hair at a beauty shop vs "Wild Ride" leaking amniotic fluid and by passing NICU hospitals just to have a child born in Alaska?
It's too easy get sidetracked on small details. We have put too into this to let fall apart.
PALIN SAYS ALASKA TOUR 'NOT FAREWELL'
... [$ARAH] hints she has a bigger role in mind, and she plans to launch her new platform by speaking her mind on the social networking site Twitter.
Palin said she is eager to begin life as a private citizen.
"Once I am 'Sarah Palin, Alaskan,' I can really call it like I see it," she said.
....
WHOA, she will call it like she sees it! IGNORANCE + POOR GRAMMAR: why do i think this will be ridiculous and yet perversly entertaining.. JON, KEITH and DAVID must be ecstatic!
"Sarah said she picked July 26 for the transition to Parnell because it is the annual Governor's Picnic, an event already planned and already to be attended by Parnell and other politicians.
Maybe the TN email sleuth, or FOIA requests, or Sherry's sentencing tomorrow has something to do with the general timing, but the picnic is the reason for July 26."
Sarah Palin, remember? She lies as easily as she breathes, only less well. Why on earth would a political picnic affect her choice of dates- especially if it was already planned for Parnell to be there?
" I wonder how she got"
And I wonder how I meant that to end. I typed the post this morning- can't remember what point I was trying to make other than she was unlikely to spend much money buying clothes she didn't intend to use very much.
BTW,
Ivyfree I loved your analysis of the scarf purchases. You just have to laugh at the contortions she must go through on a daily basis. As Diana noted -- "what a cray life she must live". The best humor is sodden with sadness.
JC
I'm not sure this went thru...LisanTX, I don't want to distract or dissuade people from the meticulous hard work they are doing in dissecting the CBC video. But, there seems to be a separate thread amongst these comments in analyzing Spalin's Personality Disorder. Thank you for actually reading her (authorized?) biography as I am sure it is mostly dreck. But you are right -- her early childhood developed this fraud/phony PD. She is the poster child of NPD. Grandiose thinking, expecting deference, and a complete inability to take criticism. I fully realize the diagnosis of her PD may be a blind alley, but it is her ultimate weakness. Who knows, someone here could exploit this flank.
Further, it keeps us from inflammatory rhetoric, e.g. KaJo calling her a psychopath -- which she is not, (nothing personal KaJo, keep up the hard work).
I think anyone here, appalled by this hoax, just wants something, anything, serendipity, to shine the light on this blatant liar and affront to humanity.
Keep up the noble effort y'all.
Joe Christmas
It seems as though we are talking about the choice of doing hair treatments on an unborn child as though Sarah was really pregnant. I don't think she really had to think about how her dye job would impact her unborn child since I don't think she had one, a child that is.
latest SALON article:
President? Get real. Sarah Palin couldn't manage a Wal-Mart. She has neither the management skills nor the capacity for detail.
wv: unharmin, which sounds like a word SP would make up.
on my thesis that it was the GOP that threatened to expose her if she did no quit; here's a comment at IM: 8:11 PM Anonymous said...
In a few months, Sarah will be old news. Wait and see. The GOP is already working in it- you all will see.
What is hilarious is that Palin and her supporters think it's Obama, the Democrats and the Dem bloggers that are creating havoc for her in Alaska. Guess what? It isn't.
It's the GOP boys club and the RNC. I don't know how Palin missed it. If she would listen she would know. The party doesn't want her running for president. They know she'll split the votes and the part weakening her chances. They've sent operatives up there to stir things up and plant seeds.
Palins going to be flipping out soon. Definitely get out the popcorn. She's furious, soon to be much more furious. She's gonna blow!
...
another odd comment of hers that hints at a GOP coup is her pathetic comment that she was willing to campaign for democrats, who immediately said, "thanks, but no way!"
If you look at the photo from State Senator French's 032908 newsletter where SP is seated at the left side of the conference table, as someone said earlier, Trig is getting squished. I don't think anyone that close to her due date could sit so close to the table, even if they are fairly short and carrying low. You could probably estimate the gap between the back of the chair and the table in inches very easily, especially since everybody else is sitting farther from the table than she is.
Amy1, thanks for the comps. The Elan Frank shot is the same day as Eileen's stairwell photo, from Audrey's Enough is Enough post. Love the polar bear pin. ("They're not extinct. I have one right here!")
Ivyfree, is your name a parody of Palinbot Ivy Frye? When you said "stick a fork in her," I couldn't help thinking of Bree's fake belly at the barbeque.
The Lohan movie last night should encourage Sarah: at the end all is forgiven, despite the line, "What kind of person would fake a pregnancy?" or something like that. However, my local paper's snippet about the movie intriqued me by saying it was an "oh so timely" movie about fake pregnancy. Could he possibly have meant because Palin is in the news?
Ivy asks why Sarah expects people to believe her. I commented many months ago about an Alaskan journalist I heard on NPR refer to Palin as "terminally pretty," from some rock song. (Running on Empty?) She has gone through life helped by her looks and charisma and has come to expect things to go her way, in a way we normal-looking plebians never have.
Just caught this over to HuffPo, whose article about $P's angry hairdresser has generated a boatload of comments:
everythinginmoderation I'm a Fan of everythinginmoderation permalink
Any woman that has had a pregnancy knows that it is common to loose a little hair after the birth. It isn't permanent. Why this is a story I will never know!
Reply Favorite Flag as abusive Posted 12:04 PM on 07/20/2009
- NakedTruth I'm a Fan of NakedTruth permalink
Because Sarah didn't have a baby. The DS baby is her grandchild. Check out palindeceptions.com.
Reply Marked as favorite Flag as abusive Posted 12:32 PM on 07/20/2009
Nice job, naked truth! xx Mrs. B
Could we shake something loose by asking Ivy Freye why she has a different birth date for Trig than Miss Wasilla claims? She said 'a week before she gave birth" when speaking of andree "jumping" her in early March.
She seems to be a real idiot with a loose twitter account. People like that who love to support the one they Worship, love to talk and talk talk and spill accidentally.
on BEEHIVE and the NYT and SARAH's thinning hair. a comment at HUFFPOST clarifies the issue:
Archivist1000 wrote:
For those of you who can't READ .. the NYT didn't quote the hairdresser, it quoted a friend who said the hairdresser said that.
So maybe the hairdresser is telling the truth: she never said that to a newspaper .. she said it to other, who then repeated it.
Ivyfree,
I think Sarah enjoys the Governor's picnics. They are non-political events where she gets to be Queen Bee among admiring Alaskans. If the picnic were real work, she would have left office before it.
I'm not saying the TN trial isn't a factor, but even if she knows what the prosecution is doing, she wouldn't know what the federal Magistrate Judge will decide. I do hope you are right, though. Once she's under oath, lies can (but may not) become perjury.
"Ivyfree, is your name a parody of Palinbot Ivy Frye?"
No. It's a contraction of Ivy Freeborn, my name in religion. I can see why you'd ask, though; when I started seeing Ivy Frye's name I was startled! But it's pure coincidence... unless of course HER name is a parody of mine. I don't put anything past palinbots.
Great comments all! Wow!
I usually get lost in the photo discussions but hope it can be figured out. We need a Hercules Poirot or Sherlock Holmes on this case, The Case of the Impregnated Governor, or The Case of the Inseminated Governor.
Anyway 2 points, the date of resignation seems so odd, I am leaning toward the TN trial starting the next day. Interesting that there was a hearing on 6/30/09 and she tells the Lt. Gov. the next day she is resigning. I agree, we need to know what happened in that hearing. Was it the threat of discovery?
2nd; I am wondering about these 1,000's of unopened packages and envelopes that Palin has received. Does she think that she can resign then she is free to keep all the gifts and checks? She has stated that she does not have to declare them until she opens them, but is that the law?
Was Sherry's sentencing hearing today? Do we have an update?
Amy1 tx for the comps,
More fun from the wonkettes today
http://wonkette.com/409956/palin-hairdresser-corrects-terrible-smear-rumors-about-balding#comments
I would think most people here are left of center, who cares? But there certainly is no shortage of snark here though. Compared to drivel like C4P, those lefties sure are funny in their comments.
As always, humor and reasoning,
JC
Re the Kernell trial in TN:
The 7/27 date for the defense to narrow their subpoena request was set by the federal magistrate judge at the 7/16 hearing, almost two weeks after SP announced her resignation.
Trev:
The 6/30 hearing in the Kernell TN trial had nothing to do with the SP subpoena.
See comment #12 in this thread:
http://www.teamtruther.com/forum/topic/116
My bad. I repeated someone else's date without checking. It's 7/31:
“We will be in court at 11 AM on July 31 for Sherry to enter her plea,” Butler explained. “She will then be taken into custody until sentencing which won’t be handed down until three to four months later."
"We need a Hercules Poirot or Sherlock Holmes on this case, The Case of the Impregnated Governor"
I'd think it would be The Case of the NON-Impregnated Governor. Talk about the curious incident of the dog in the night-time!
The Knoxville trial for the email charges is not until October. On June 30 the defense argued the charges should be dismissed.
I think they also argued that Palin's yahoo account wasn't private because she already had made personal info public and because she used the account for public government business. To show this, the defense wants to subpoena lots of info from Palin, including her children's birthdates.
The Magistrate gave the defense until July 27 to pare down its subpoena list or to justify its requests. Palin's resignation was said to make promptness important, so perhaps the defense will act before the 7/27 deadline.
www.knoxnews.com/news/2009/jul/17/long-list-of-palin-records-sought/
I think the photo was taken the same day as this one, dated May 17, 2007 (if the AP can be trusted) - It looks as thought both she and Karen Rehfield are wearing the same clothing as the one in the video:
http://www.daylife.com/photo/0gsoeR172ifwi
By the way, as far as her scarf history, the earliest I can date her with a scarf is October 18, 2007: http://www.sitka.com/akday2007/pages/akday2007%20(66).htm
The next time after that is October 28, 2007:
http://ltgov.alaska.gov/large_photo.php?id=153
Ugh, I love that rumors of Sarah's hair thinning are being called "terrible smears."
You know what? I'm 23 and when I was 18 my hair started thinning from poor nutrition (first year in college, stress, etc).
The minute I started eating healthier over summer break it stopped. My guess is that's what's happening with Sarah.
Combine her rumored diet of Diet Dr. Pepper on the campaign trail, the immense stress she was under, and then the pressure to keep up a national image once she returned home - it's enough to make ANYBODY'S hair fall out.
So if anything it seems to me a sympathetic story if true (and I think it is, her hair has looked exceedingly fake lately), but I guess when your whole political image is built around your ACTUAL image, it can be a "smear". Good lord.
VANITY FAIR strikes again.
$P's grammatical wreck of a resignation speech is red lined. actually there was so much needed editing that it ended up being multicolored:
http://www.vanityfair.com/politics/features/2009/07/palin-speech-edit-200907
B,
"terminally pretty" is from Life in the Fast Lane by the Eagles:
"He was a hard-headed man /
He was brutally handsome /
And she was terminally pretty."
Oh my.
Vanity Fair copy edits and fact checks SP's resignation speech.
The results are amazing.
http://www.vanityfair.com/politics/features/2009/07/palin-speech-edit-200907?currentPage=1
Spintest, SP isn't wearing the same clothing in that photo as the video Audrey posted. Your photo has no scarf and a red shirt that was not present in Audrey's video.
http://tinyurl.com/lbfcns
Article about June 30 hearing.
There wasn't anything that would
panic her into quitting on that day.
The Attorney may have said something about asking for the
emails that day but it wasn't
part of that days hearing.
July 1 there was another hearing
where the defense atty. sought the
judges approval of the use of a
juror questionnaire to ferret out
candidates prejudices in what he
contends is a case mired in
polarizing politics.
spintest: she is wearing a red shirt under the jacket in the photo you link too, but in the other videos, no shirt under.
hoping you are wrong!
It Took Sarah Palin's Wee Brain 27 Minutes to Compose 5 Conjoined Tweets / The Cajun Boy
Surely you've read the Twitter works of noted wordsmith Sarah Palin and wondered to yourself, "How does she string together such poetry so effortlessly?" Very, very slowly!
Now, we follow Palin's trainwreck Twitter account, which we sincerely feel is the best thing the internet has ever produced, so we're well-versed in her unique brand of tweet-buffoonery, but what we hadn't noticed previously was the time it takes for her to condense the broad thoughts conjured up by her leviathan intellect down to 140-character tweets.
The hitch in catching on to this was taking notice of her tweets within the first hour of their publication, when they're still logged chronologically on Twitter dashboards by the system in minute time frames.
...These five tweets are all conjoined, all part of the same dipshit-y thought, which was another one of her maniacal rants about the endless stream of ethics complaints logged against her. ...
In total, it took Palin 27 minutes to spit out this one thought, and it was still expressed almost completely incoherently.
In an article Palin says that she found out Trig had Down Syndrome at 13 weeks. (I don't remember hearing that specific number before; I could have missed it.)
"But at age 43, pregnant and at 13 weeks along learning that the baby would be born with Down syndrome, the situation necessitated a decision: Would I live what I've talked and taught? Or would I take a different path out of these perhaps less than ideal circumstances? I'm so thankful God gave us the strength and optimism to welcome Trig into our lives. God has gifted us with this child who has given us a way to connect with others around our country who also have special needs children. It's been nothing but wonderful."
http://tinyurl.com/q7q5wo
http://www.gofishproductions.net/home/T287-todd-sarah-palin
(More likely the truth was that, Bristol, at 13 weeks, learned Trig had DS or the statement is a complete fabrication.)
@Spintest, I could only see your last link but in that link, SP is outside wearing an outdoor scarf with her coat. When we look for the scarf, we look for wearing one inside with her suits. Different context. I can't address the other two links since I couldn't get them to open.
I have a possible name for the mystery: The Case of the Empty Uterus.
Jen
About the service flag at the office - is it possible that it's not a personal one, but rather one to represent all the Alaskans in the military at the moment? Or is that too off-label a use? Or has SP already confirmed it's her personal one?
spintest
I don't think that picture taken May 16th is the same day as the one we are trying to date. There is no scarf and Sarah is wearing a red blouse that she did not have on in the other pictures. Also it does not look as though Karen has on the white pin in the picture we are trying to date.
Correction:
First time I have Palin accessorizing with a big scarf (over inner or outer wear) is October 18, 2007:
http://www.sitka.com/akday2007
If you click the forward arrow three times, you come to this:
http://www.sitka.com/akday2007/images/akday2007%20(66).jpg
The very first time I have Palin wearing the big scarf over inner wear is January 15, 2008:
http://kodiakkonfidential.blogspot.com/2008/01/i-just-dropped-in-to-see-what-state-of.html
However, one of the commenters posted beneath it:
"Scadooby said...
How do I contact the governess and politely request that she quit already with the ubiquitous scarf and give us the cleavage we voted for????
8:33 PM, January 16, 2008"
If anybody has evidence of "ubiquitous scarf"-wearing over innerwear prior to 1/16/08, I'd like to see it.
Patrick, Audrey, and anyone else who's interested:
You might take a look at the admittedly tiny picture that I pieced together of Sarah Palin in that picture posing with the two Representatives on 3/28/08, and the infamous Gusty photo 4/13/08.
Look where Palin's hands are.
Is her deception ridiculous after seeing that, or not? (YES!)
http://tinyurl.com/n2a2mu
Spintest @ 1:40am,
I beg to differ when you say the 5/17/07 PHOTO is the same day as the CBC video shoot...
For one thing, on 5/17/07, Sarah isn't even WEARING A SCARF, and the lapel pins are different...
I could go on, but I think I'm spinning my wheels.
Your other two links HERE and HERE to outdoor winter knit scarf events don't in any way compare to her indoor pg silky scarf disguise at all.
*** Dangerous said...
B,
"terminally pretty" is from Life in the Fast Lane by the Eagles:
"He was a hard-headed man /
He was brutally handsome /
And she was terminally pretty."***
Actually, it's even better...
"And she was terminally vain."
OFF TOPIC
SARAH'S ETHICS IN QUESTION
http://tinyurl.com/mvyce9
I'm sure nearly everyone has read this by the time it gets posted.
- Further, it keeps us from inflammatory rhetoric, e.g. KaJo calling her a psychopath -- which she is not. -
Joe Christmas - July 19 - 8:21 PM
Joe, I am going to have to take issue with your statement above, because you say it with such authority. I believe that you said you were a doctor and your mother is a narcissist, which could give you some information on personality disorders but doesn't mean that you are up to date with the research that has emerged over the last ten to twenty years in the field studying psychopathy. Referring to it as "inflammatory rhetoric" tells me that this is not an area of expertise for you.
I have spent a large part of the last ten years reading, learning and observing personality disorders, particularly psychopathy with a special interest in how it manifests in women. On a part-time basis, I work with people who have been impacted by psychopaths. As part of that service, I explain to them how psychopaths operate and how to tell them apart from narcissists and people with environmentally caused anti social disorder. Within that context, I use Sarah Palin as an example of a woman scoring high on the psychopathic checklist.
The Psychopathic Checklist is the gold standard used by serious researchers in the field to determine who in fact is a psychopath. It was developed by the Canadian professor Robert Hare, who also advises and trains the FBI. There are twenty items on the checklist - half are intrinsic characteristics to who the person is while the other half are how these characteristics play out in lifestyle choices. These items include;
being glib and superficial
egocentric and grandiose
lack of remorse or guilt
lack of empathy
deceitful and manipulative
having shallow emotions
being impulsive
poor behaviour controls
having a need for excitement
lack of responsibility
early behaviour problems
and displaying anti-social behaviour
How does the above list not describe SP's behaviour? When you look more closely at how the traits are commonly displayed by people on the checklist, the match up with what we know about SP is even more striking. Many people who score high on the checklist are thought to be narcissists because narcissistic traits are part of being a psychopath. If, however, we look at occurrences levels in the population we find that only .67 of one percent of the population are narcissists while the rate of people who cross the threshold of the checklist to be full fledge psychopaths are one to three percent of the population. More importantly, another ten percent of the population fall just below the threshold but have enough of the traits to do serious harm to others.
To answer the other commenter's question - research has disclosed that the critical traits, such as lack of empathy, needed to be diagnosed as a psychopath are due to faulty wiring in the brain. Some of it is heritable, although it can occur spontaneously. Certain head injuries can also create the damage to the brain with the same effect. Environment does play a huge role on how these tendencies caused by miss-wiring in the brain manifest themselves over a person's life span.
If you are interested, I will tell you about the research that shows that SP's word salads are typical for a psychopath.
spintest, your video shows Palin scarfless in a red blouse. Only the necklace is the same. Not it.
Concerning Palin's legal defense fund, is the idea that if Palin refuses money from the fund then the ethics complaint will be dropped? And that she quit her job to earn more money because she'll have to pay her own legal bills? Why would she keep raising money for the fund after she learned she couldn't use it? And did Coale give her bad advice about setting up the fund? (You get what you pay for.)
Just trying to figure out if this is the iceberg.
Okay I found this comment on Grphyen’s Immoral Minority blog. The post is titled:
“Let’s take a mental health moment and enjoy…:dated Sunday, July 5, 2009.
Syrin has left an extremely interesting comment on Shannyn Moore’s blog:
“There are several more RUMORS going around.
Such as: Palin was found guilty of abuse and misconduct for wrong doing with her ‘Legal Defense Fund” (WHY DOES SOMEONE ETHICAL NEED A LEGAL DEFENSE FUND?) millons of dollars are said to be un accounted for RUMORED embezzlement- Sarah Pac sponsored?… She was given an ultimatum (I think this is highly improper, possibly unlawful) by her appointed 3 member personnal board that she, if continues to be the Gov the TRUTH of the matter would have to come out and the whole mess and paper trail would have to be released to the public. However, it’s RUMORED if she RESIGNS she was told by that appointed 3 member board that determines ETHICAL matters in the State of Alaska that she can essentially TAKE THE MONEY AND RUN!!!!!!!!!!!
Just a RUMOR”
Hmmm…somebody knew something
Hello from Janie,
Just back from family time at the beach. Everyone looked at me like I was horrible and crazy when I said that Trig was the daughter's son. One sister said that if that were true, it would be out in the open by now...my other sister said I was a mean spirited liberal.
UUUGGGGHH. The real story has got to come out! How can I say "I told you so, if it doesn't"?!?! I can't believe how almost angry people get when I mention the Trig/Bristol/SP.
I will have to say that it is amazing that they have kept this from blowing up and the truth coming out. She must have some kinda hold in Alaska.
Oh well...go team go!
janie in tallahassee
p.s. we are right about this, aren't we?
KaJo, that's a great photo comparison. Her hands went up and out that far in two weeks? No way.
I bet there are other shots of her hands clasped in front of her that could be similarly compared.
Thanks for thinking of this!
p.s. - Dangerous and NYTChick, thanks for ID'ing the song. I thought "Running on Empty" seemed appropriate for Palin, but Fast Lane's "terminally vain" fits.
About service flags: I live in the kind of community where there are still Mom & Pop type stores, a family operation that is still part of a national chain. It is chummy here; regulars stop to chat and the people who run the local hardware store are very open about sharing updates about their family.
A member of their family is a priest, serving in Iraq as an army chaplain. From time to time, they collection donations when Father Joe wrote home about a worthy cause. And, they proudly display their service flag in the front window of the hardware store because there is so much community interest in their relative.
I don't find anything wrong with Sarah's displaying a service flag in her office window. Is this the office in Anchorage where she did spend alot time? It would be included in plenty of official photographs taken of her in the course of business. She is more than happy to "use the troops" to bolster her patriotism.
I think that Sarah is up to her eyeballs in alot of other things. That Alaska Fund Trust is going under the microscope. She has boxes of unopened mail and checks which she doesn't consider "received" until she actually opens them.
(When UPS or FedEx delivers a package and scans the tracking number in as "delivered," that person "received" the package. Whether they choose to open it or not doesn't matter; it was delivered.)
My hope right now is that after Sarah leaves office, some of her power may be diminished. (Some say that she plans to pull strings behind the scene, but she may not have the same clout). When Sarah loses her "hold" on people, maybe someone will be glad to talk, take National Enquirer's bait, finally "get even." Since Sarah is so fond of quotes, I'll quote Yogi Berra:
"It ain't over 'till it's over."
LisanTX: Thanks for that link with the "13 weeks" quote.
I recall that when I had amnio (15 yrs ago), it took about a week after the procedure, before you get the results.
This quote you showed us has her saying she KNEW at 13 weeks, so that means an amnio done at 12 weeks, which has got to be very rarely done. Please correct me if I'm wrong, those of you who are familiar with more recent technology.
(Yes, I know, SHE never had the amnio -- it's a lie. But yet another discrepancy presented as if we would believe it.)
KAJO, thanks for the composite image. if you add the dates of each picture, we got a persuasive tableaux!
VERA CITY, please continue...
B & NYtabchick,
"... terminally vain" is a good alternative lyric, and "vain" does rhyme with "lane" in the title of the song, but the actual lyric is "terminally pretty" as B quoted.
On another topic, I don't know if anyone saw the Hardball segment of a "town-hall" meeting in nearby (to me) Delaware where the woman went off about Obama's "natural born" questions. Fortunately, Rep. Mike Castle (R) -- who I've met several times and is a good guy -- let the woman make herself sound foolish then calmly said that Obama was a US citizen. Then they recited the Pledge of Allegiance!!
This made me consider the difference between Trig birth questions and Obama birth questions. Both are factual questions, so arguments are not particularly interesting or informative. Obama produced a certified birth certificate that should have ended the nonsense.
But it doesn't. Without evidence, many people believe Obama was born somewhere else, although they refuse to offer evidence to support that assertion. They only conclude any effort to support the documented version is a hoax.
Meanwhile the issues surrounding Trig get zero MSM attention, despite the documented bizarreness regarding his gestation and delivery. Everyone (including me) initially thought SP must be covering for Bristol. That made sense, given the evidence at the time.
Then, they Bristol's pregnancy with Tripp, she gives birth, and MSM concludes that SP didn't cover for Bristol after all. Meanwhile, on PD and elsewhere (including Vanity Fair, one could suspect) some hold that Trig is Bristol's child.
However, just like those Obama "birthers", Bx2 proponents offer no evidence to support their assertion, just theories and speculation. And you wonder why MSM doesn't take you seriously? They lump you into the same group as the Birthers for the same reason: no evidence.
I don't have evidence to prove Willow is Trig's mother, either. But my central assertion is she could be. Bristol has what most people feel is a rock-solid alibi by having given birth to Tripp. All any of you can say is that Bristol could have given birth to Trig in mid-January, provided you ignore the circumstantial problems with that theory and the lack of direct evidence. And ignore that he appears to be a newborn in April, meaning he had to be very premature and anonymously shelved in a NICU somewhere.
Put that all together, and is it any wonder serious people think you're nuts? You might be right, but you better develop some evidence. Nobody (except here on PD) laughs me out of the room when I suggest it could be Willow. And we know Willow didn't give birth later in 2008. Think about it.
Dangerous
GRYPHEN is asking:
Why was Rupert Murdoch's giant yacht in Juneau?
And why is his 737 STILL there? Is this the beginning of Sarah's next big carer move?
Enquiring minds want to know. If anybody has inside information please send it my way.
@ Joe Christmas: I didn't actually catch what you said until vera city's reponse to you July 21, 2009 4:47 PM when she quoted what you said I said, back in your comment @ July 19, 2009 8:21 PM.
If you're going to criticize me for "inflammatory rhetoric", please criticize what I ACTUALLY said ("sociopathic") instead of your interpretation of what I said ("psychopath"). See my original response to Wayofpeace @ July 18, 2009 11:18 AM.
Granted, after reading this explanation and what vera city posted, I may have been too kind in calling Palin "merely" sociopathic... :)
Remember a few comments above yesterday @ 2:34 PM where I posted a link to a comparison photo I did showing Palin posing with the 2 state Reps. March 28, 2008, alongside the Gusty photo Apr. 13, 2008?
Well, I've improved on that picture a bit -- take a look.
I added a couple of similar poses by Palin over a broader range of time -- the oldest one is on the left, Dec. 5, 2007 -- then the Gov. conference picture on Feb. 26, 2008 (adjusted to allow for tilt and wide angle distortion) -- then the pose with the state Reps on March 28, 2008, and two separate pictures taken of Palin in her "pregnant" picture April 13, 2008 (mirror-images to show her hands; also adjusted to allow for perspective distortion -- something we discussed many months ago).
"If you are interested, I will tell you about the research that shows that SP's word salads are typical for a psychopath."
I would be interested. If you have time and are willing.
KaJo
Nice side by side. I've cut & pasted it into my tin-foil dossier!
:)
Punk.
KaJo - excellent photo comparison - and a most excellent point it illustrates. So not possible!
*** Dangerous said...
B & NYtabchick,
"... terminally vain" is a good alternative lyric, and "vain" does rhyme with "lane" in the title of the song, but the actual lyric is "terminally pretty" as B quoted.***
Thanks! So this is another reason why I only sing when I'm alone!
KaJo, as I stated in my original post, I have NO intentions of dissuading you from the fine work you are doing. Really, I was not being critical, my point was only that we try to clarify this concurrent thread as to Spalin's mental disorder and stay relatively civil in our word choices. Please, no hard feelings.
My other point was that this parallel thread may be her Achilles heel.
vera city, I stand corrected, I am an ER doc and usually stick to the DSM for descriptive diagnosis. Your thoughtful analysis is what I was after in my comments. Someone, anyone who could actually diagnose her further can only help us. If, as you outline, she is a psychopath, then that only makes our endeavour even more important.
I truly believe we are all on the same wavelength, i.e. to expose this fraudulent, vacuous, simpleton. (Each one of these accusations I would stand by as having a factual base.) So go vera, let us know what you know. I only want us all to be educated.
Did anyone notice that early during Spalin's July 3rd quittin' speech that Trig was bawling in Piper's arms? Spalin was oblivious, as usual. Then someone took him away, "We need more Trig's, not less"???!!?
Dangerous,
It's simple really, just google Trig's birth certificate...nothing, nada, just the usual blanks... then google Obama's...and, surprise, there it is.
Limbaugh tells this lame joke about what God and Obama have in common, (I add Trig too), UHHH NO birth certificate....crickets
Finally, Janie_sandie, I think we've all been there. My wife rolls here eyes when I start. But, since Sept of last year, I would bet my putting stroke that Trig is not from Spalin's womb. Hang in there, no one knows how, but she will implode.
Again, highest regards to anyone here,
Joe Christmas
Audrey, I'm dying of curiosity. When was the video was made? Has CBC or MSNBC given you an answer?
I'm remembering the strange square cushion version of Sarah's pregnancy, where the rounded corners of the cushions show in the video. So, this time, the edges are hidden by the loose hanging jacket. But the bottom had to be hidden, too, maybe by folding her hands just so. Just a guess here, Thanks for the side by side by side pictures, KaJo!
Kajo,
I think you have improved them but they are still too small and dark for me. can they be made lighter?
just saying....and this may have been posted already
remember back in the old days, when we were all examining the boxes in the hallway - the very one a big bellied GiNO stood in front of 'being interviewed for tv...(hahahha)...
well...
over at mudflats,(the Backlog of Snippets!Post) the moving truck has the same logo on it....
in case you missed them, here are a couple of great zingers from SHANNYN's blog:
SHANNYN:
Palinistas: People who fight for Palin even if the facts prove she is dead wrong.
Not to be confused with Palinbots. Palinbots: don’t know much about her, but think she’s pretty and just like them.
SHELDON:
The next time Palin takes responsobility for her actions will be the first.
Teal: I was all over that logo (on the box in Gusty photo and on the moving truck on mudflats today -- only I think it's a trash truck, not a moving truck) because logo had a strange gap in it that I thought was a photoshop flaw (in the Gusty photo). So sad to discover this is the logo (complete ith gap and off color variation) of a huge disposal company -- I even saw one of their trucks in my lower-48 neighborhood. So it made sense that among these boxes in the hall in Gusty photo there would be some from the trash pick-up company.azindli
Hey JoeChristmas -- Thx for your message to KaJo. As a long-time contributor, I have discovered that KaJo is ALWAYS RIGHT. Seriously. And has sent us many arcane and accurate facts. (full disclosure: I don't know her except from here.)
I'm glad you are firmly aboard, and in view of the topic you are helping us noodle, I wonder if it's not finally time for us to consider the role of CBJ--not in the birth of Trig, let's leave that out. We have flogged that poor horse enough and need at least an iota more of real data, new real data, before we do so again.
But in view of CBJ's specialty, why is she the family MD? Could it be that her specialty is related to SP's mental disability? That SP's disability was caused by something CBJ treats? Just askin.
(And yes, I am bearing in mind that it's possible CBJ was not the family MD, that this too is a lie. And that SP picked CBJ as the victim-MD-signatory for the letter SP faked and released the night before Election Day.)
vera_city: I too am interested in anything further you have to say.
Wayofpeace and Ivyfree, before I talk about the word salad I want to address some other points that came up. KaJo, I understand your desire to be quoted correctly. In this case, it highlights the confusion between the two words psychopath and sociopath. It is one of the most frequent questions I am asked. The two words are interchangeable and mean the same thing - almost. The difference, in current use, is the belief of the person using each term on what causes the disorder. Dr. Hare explains:
"In many cases the choice of term reflects the user's views on the origins and determinants of the clinical syndrome or disorder described in this book [Without Conscience]. Thus, some clinicians and researchers - as well as most sociologists and criminologists - who believe that the syndrome is forged entirely by social forces and early experiences prefer the term sociopath, whereas those - including this writer - who feel that psychological, biological, and genetic factors also contribute to the development of the syndrome generally use the term psychopath. The same individual therefore could be diagnosed as a sociopath by one expert and as a psychopath by another."
That was written in 1993: the body of solid research showing significant genetic and biological differences between people on the psychopathic spectrum and the general population has grown substantially since then. When KaJo wrote sociopath, I also switched it to the term I use which is psychopath.
Joe Christmas, if you read what I wrote carefully, you will notice that I did not call SP a psychopath. I stated that she is high on the Psychopathic Checklist. I tend to err on the cautious side when I am looking at an individual. The checklist is a spectrum with a threshold that can be crossed at any period in the person's life to get the diagnosis of psychopath. It was developed by studying male convicts so the diagnosis is weighted to their behaviour. Researchers, however, found that there are important gender differences on how the traits manifest in women. For example: women will display more aggressive, controlling and abusive behaviour towards family members, partners and people close to them, such as ex in-laws, while males will strike out towards strangers as well. Men are also more likely to use physical aggression while the women tend to use psychological manipulation. Because the women's behaviour is more often directed towards people they know, it is less reported and less noticed by others. (After all, it was only SP's ambition to play on the big stage that brought her and her behaviour to our attention.) Because of these and other factors, the threshold for a woman to cross to be a psychopath is actually lower than it is for men.
Where people can quibble if SP passes the threshold or not, it is a strong position to argue that she scores high on the checklist. It is not a binary diagnosis that a person is either a psychopath or not a psychopath. It is a scale where those who fall just below the threshold can do incredible damage and their suitability to hold public office or parent should be seriously questioned.
Joe, you made a good call when you pointed out SP's obliviousness to Trig's tears. It is the complete lack of empathy and concern for the feelings of others that defines the faulty wiring of this disorder.
A few starting points on SP's word salads. Keep her in mind as you read these passages from Hare:
"...pathological lying and manipulation are not restricted to psychopaths. What makes psychopaths different from all others is the remarkable ease with which they lie, the pervasiveness of their deception, and the callousness with which they carry it out. But there is something else about the speech patterns of psychopaths that is equally puzzling: their frequent use of contradictory and logically inconsistent statements that usually escape detection. Recent research on the language of psychopaths provides us with some important clues to this puzzle, as well as to the uncanny ability psychopaths have to move words - and people - around so easily."
"Think about this for a moment - not only lies but several contradictory statements in the same breath. Very perplexing. It is as if psychopaths sometimes have difficulty in monitoring their own speech, and they let loose with a convoluted barrage of poorly connected words and thoughts. Psychopaths also sometimes put words together in strange ways."
More soon.
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